Overwritten.net
Games => General Gaming => Topic started by: Quemaqua on Thursday, December 17, 2009, 03:08:50 PM
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We're going to need a thread for it sooner or later, so here it is. And we'll start with goofy Japanese TV hosts playing it:
KYOUDAI MONSTAA DESU NEE! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eyDrdVSpTUg)
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Nice video, it was good to see some more gameplay and the battle music that I heard sounded good. I can't wait until it comes out.
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hard to tell, but it looks like it's got a character combo move system similar to chrono trigger.
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Opening Cinematic Released (http://www.gametrailers.com/video/japanese-game-final-fantasy/60136)
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Listen to what we'll get to hear when it comes out in the States:
http://www.giantbomb.com/final-fantasy-xiii-english-voiceover-and-leona-lewis/17-1870/
Sounds pretty terrible to me. The more I see of this game the more I feel I want nothing to do with it. It's Final Fantasy, but it's gone completely too far into the emo/whiny/fake-dramatic direction.
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I'm only really looking forward to Final Fantasy Versus XIII anyway. Possibly Final Fantasy Agito XIII on the PSP as well.
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Listen to what we'll get to hear when it comes out in the States:
http://www.giantbomb.com/final-fantasy-xiii-english-voiceover-and-leona-lewis/17-1870/
Sounds pretty terrible to me. The more I see of this game the more I feel I want nothing to do with it. It's Final Fantasy, but it's gone completely too far into the emo/whiny/fake-dramatic direction.
I just saw the new trailer over at joystiq. I was headed to the Fallout 3 thread here, but I saw this along the way. I've said before that Square should consider releasing FF episodes on video DVD. FF XII gave me hope that they were heading in a better direction, finally. Now, though, I'm skeptical once more. Bluray video seems more appropriate for 95% of what I just saw.
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Short blurb from 1Up on FF XIII evolving as a PS2 game and then becoming a PS3 game - which in fact they believe cost them 1 year and a half delay. (http://www.1up.com/do/newsStory?cId=3177772)
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I never saw this come on here, so it must be posted.
Join the cult of Final Fantasy! (http://www.giantbomb.com/inside-final-fantasy-xiii/17-1637/)
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The battle system is my biggest fear so far (plus excessive FMV always a worry with Square's games). After XII, I expected real-time combat to evolve, not devolve. I can't judge from what little I've seen whether this "Paradigm Shift" is a step in the right direction. It seems like a return to turn-based combat.
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I hear what you're saying, Cobra, but I'm actually glad they're heading back to turn-based. I enjoyed FFXII and its combat, but TB feels like home.
Edit: Oh, and yeah, Si, that does look a little cultish. Sign me up.
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According to this entry on Major Nelson's blog, the Final Fantasy XIII Special Edition Bundle will cost $400. (http://majornelson.com/archive/2010/02/11/10-things-you-need-to-know-from-x10.aspx)
You'll get:
a 250GB Hard Drive
two Wireless Controllers
exclusive downloadable content
Standard Edition copy of the game
It's nice to see the 250GB drive available, but I wish I didn't have to buy a JRPG and controllers I don't need to get it. they're still overcharging for it though. Subtract the $60 game, two $50 controllers, and the DLC (probably $10-15), that makes the HDD $225. No wonder they're only selling it in a bundle, it's to mask the price.
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There are conflicting reports whether or not there will be DLC with FFXIII.
That said, I'm still not sure if I want to buy this game or not. Reviews have thus far been quite mixed. It has a good battle system but I hear the plot sucks.
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w7re, you do realise that bundle includes the console as well, right?
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w7re, you do realise that bundle includes the console as well, right?
ROFL oops. Well think about it, the 120GB drive is $150, which is more than $1 per GB. So $225 doesn't seem too far off. Though $400 is the same price as the MW2 bundle that had a 250GB and two controllers.
Well damnit, I want the drive but not the rest. If I'd had the spare cash I would have totally bought a MW2 bundle and sold my current Xbox.
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from all the rumours i've heard they're coming out separately very soon. they're already out in japan and all signs are pointing to them replacing the 120gb upgrade kit with a 250gb model in europe - so i'm guessing that NA won't be far behind.
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Here is an interesting story (http://www.joystiq.com/2010/02/05/xbox-360-120gb-hdd-discounted-in-the-us-too-again-while-suppli/) I read recently at joystiq about the 120GB HDD. I've also discovered that you can buy third-party 360 replacement shells for 2.5" HDDs, and then use appropriately sized drives in them. But after Microsoft's dick move against unlicensed memory cards, I'd be very leery of this.
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Square Enix has NO plans for Final Fantasy XIII DLC. (http://kotaku.com/5471819/square-enix-has-no-plans-for-final-fantasy-xiii-dlc?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+kotaku%2Ffull+%28Kotaku%29)
In an age in which downloadable content is often discussed when a game is released (or even before!), Square Enix has stated that it does not have currently have any plans for Final Fantasy XIII DLC.
"Regarding the DLC content, we feel that the final product is 100% enjoyable…it's the complete package," says Final Fantasy XIII producer, Yoshinori Kitase, and director, Motomu Toriyama in a joint statement." So we're not planning any DLC at this time."
No plans. At this time. That doesn't exactly rule out planning for the future, now does it?
"In regard to the rumored cut content, we feel it was taken out of context," the pair continues. "There are a lot of ideas that are brought to the table, and then the team takes the best ideas out of those, and the final product is polished that way." A lot of those ideas were just that: ideas. They didn't make the final cut and are not in the game. According to Square Enix, the team is not looking into releasing this unused content as DLC.
Perhaps Square Enix is not ready to discuss downloadable content, and that's fine. But if there's no DLC, there will be disappointed FFXIII players. These days, DLC is not just expected, but a given.
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Fuck Kotaku. Oh, here's a complete game with no need for DLC! Let's whine about it because we want to pay more money for things with no value. You worthless shitbags. Die in a fire.
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I think it's refreshing to hear what Square Enix has said to say about NO DLC for FFXIII. Kudos to them.
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Ditto, what the H.E. Double Hockey Sticks are these people bitching about??!
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Actually, I think they are just clarifying the conflicting reports that there was going to be DLC. I remember very clearly reading that Square Enix was at one point considering DLC not more than a few weeks ago. Hell, even that special edition Xbox360 bundle says there's exclusive 'downloadable content'. This new report clears it up.
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During a recent interview with Xbox World 360 magazine (via CVG), Toriyama explained, "we think many reviewers are looking at Final Fantasy XIII from a western point of view." He later added, "when you look at most Western RPGs, they just dump you in a big open world, and let you do whatever you like... it becomes very difficult to tell a compelling story when you're given that much freedom."
joystiq (http://www.joystiq.com/2010/02/16/final-fantasy-xiii-director-comments-on-linearity-early-reviews/)
Can't let player freedom get in the way of telling a long story, can we? No, players must be led by the nose.
Pass.
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Fuck Kotaku. Oh, here's a complete game with no need for DLC! Let's whine about it because we want to pay more money for things with no value. You worthless shitbags. Die in a fire.
Thank you. I fucking hate Kotaku. Not because they are terrible, but because their popularity will lead a whole generation of gamers to believe that their standards are what define good journalism.
joystiq (http://www.joystiq.com/2010/02/16/final-fantasy-xiii-director-comments-on-linearity-early-reviews/)
Can't let player freedom get in the way of telling a long story, can we? No, players must be led by the nose.
Pass.
While I am the last person to defend a Japanese RPG (I would never play a Jap. "RPG" over one from a western developer), I do agree with him to a certain degree. The lesser the freedom, the more controlled the narrative. It doesn't mean you can't tell a great story in an open ended RPG, but it just means you have to put a lot more effort into it.... or you end up with Oblivion.
All he says is that it becomes more difficult, and that's true. Either you as a studio can put all of your effort into a linear path, and come up with a game as artistically and cinematically rich as Final Fantasy (I don't like the games, but I can't deny their strengths), or you can put an equal effort into making equally rich multiple paths. Of course, that requires a lot more resources, and hence the difficulty of such an endeavor.
Even Bioware games, which offer many well developed and rich paths in a single game, aren't completely perfect. In games like Dragon Age and Mass Effect 2 (as awesome as they are), I still came across portions which I found were obviously curtailed, or where things played out a certain way more for the sake of budgetary concerns than artistic merits.
When you offer players a lot more freedom, you end up with a lot more variables to design for, and a lot of loose ends to tie towards the end. It is why the companions that may or may not have died in Mass Effect 1, ended up as non recruitable in the sequel, and only with a few lines of dialog that were almost completely out of character, and simply created to write those characters out of the universe.
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While I am the last person to defend a Japanese RPG (I would never play a Jap. "RPG" over one from a western developer), I do agree with him to a certain degree. The lesser the freedom, the more controlled the narrative. It doesn't mean you can't tell a great story in an open ended RPG, but it just means you have to put a lot more effort into it.... or you end up with Oblivion.
Or with Fallout 3, one of the best games I've ever played. No, it isn't perfect, but I would much rather put up with those imperfections than with a straitjacket. This is a long debate, whether story or freedom is more important. I always side with the latter. What ticked me off the most about what I quoted was the smug "we know better" attitude. "It's my game, not the player's". Yeah, and it's my money, and I'm not spending it here. You want to recite me a story while I listen attentively, put it in a book or a movie. What happens in a game better be much more up to me than that.
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I actually got a very Final Fantasy feel from Mass Effect 2's structure, despite the multiple paths. You get some story taht gives you an objective, you head there and do it, get some more story/cutscenes. Maybe it was the way it held my attention like FF games used to, but it felt like a similar game structure, but without the emo anime manboy main character. After ME2 I don't think I can play any more JRPGs because it makes them all feel like a tired and dated setup.
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I preordered it today. To be honest I have no idea if I'm going to like it or not but it's the next big game release and it seems like it will be a good time sink. I'll wait and see how the western audience reviews are and decide whether or not to cancel the preorder or not.
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but it's the next big game release
BFBC2 is out a week before :p
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Or with Fallout 3, one of the best games I've ever played. No, it isn't perfect, but I would much rather put up with those imperfections than with a straitjacket. This is a long debate, whether story or freedom is more important. I always side with the latter. What ticked me off the most about what I quoted was the smug "we know better" attitude. "It's my game, not the player's". Yeah, and it's my money, and I'm not spending it here. You want to recite me a story while I listen attentively, put it in a book or a movie. What happens in a game better be much more up to me than that.
From what I understand Fallout 3 is a better game than Oblivion. It seems to have less freedom, but at the same time the optional stuff is better written.
Anyway you might find this interesting:
http://kotaku.com/5475175/alan-wake-used-to-be-an-open+world-game
Regarding the long debate, it isn't really one, at least in my eyes, because I don't see one as better than the other. I think they are equally important, but I obviously prefer western RPGs to JRPGs. I would rather there be an open world, but with more focused gameplay. So much of the content in Oblivion was undercooked... yes I put a 100 hours into the game, but still. :P
I think this is why I loved games like Deus Ex and Baldur's Gate II so much. Both the games (the the latter a lot more so than the former) were pretty damn huge, but there was so much attention to detail.
Regarding the smug attitude, you may remember this from Bioware:
http://news.cnet.com/8301-13506_3-10419828-17.html
In recent years, the U.S. role-playing game landscape has become decidedly dominated by Western-based games, like Mass Effect 2 and the recently released Dragon Age: Origins. But according to Greg Zeschuk, co-founder of role-playing game company BioWare, Japanese developers might have only themselves to blame.
Speaking in an interview with Destructoid, Zeschuk said "the fall of the Japanese RPG (JRPG) in large part is due to a lack of evolution, a lack of progression." Zeschuk added that developers "kept delivering the same thing over and over. They make the dressing better, they look prettier, but it's still the same experience."
But Zeschuk wasn't done. He said the same methods used years ago to advance a story are still being employed in today's Japanese RPGs.
"My favorite thing, it's funny when you still see it, but the joke of some of the dialogue systems where it asks, 'do you wanna do this or this,' and you say no. 'Do you wanna do this or this?' No. 'Do you wanna do this or this?' No. Lemme think--you want me to say 'yes.' And that, unfortunately, really characterized the JRPG."
As someone who absolutely loves role-playing games, that's a tough pill to swallow. I can still remember the good ol' days playing Lunar: Silver Star Story Complete to its completion in an almost nonstop gaming session.
At the same time, Zeschuk makes a point. RPGs are not what they used to be. They have evolved. And so far, the vast majority of Japanese-based RPGs that I've played recently reflect that same, old-school feeling. It's not always a bad thing, of course, but for the broader U.S. audience, if Zeschuk can be believed, it's starting to hurt sales.
But yea I do agree with you.
What angered me somewhat was when some prominent Japanese developer said after the release of Bioshock that western developers were finally getting better than the Japanese ones.
That ticked me off, becaue he proceeded to name games which had already been franchises on the PC.
I just wanted to shake him and say, no you idiot, they've always been better... you just didn't bother playing the games.
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I preordered it today. To be honest I have no idea if I'm going to like it or not but it's the next big game release and it seems like it will be a good time sink. I'll wait and see how the western audience reviews are and decide whether or not to cancel the preorder or not.
haha I preordered it as well. The only FF game I played was FF8 and I got into it until the bugs just became intolerable. Plus the interface was like it came out of a monkey's butt.
Anyway I have the PS3 so I felt I had to preorder it. I will try my best to like it. :)
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haha I preordered it as well. The only FF game I played was FF8 and I got into it until the bugs just became intolerable. Plus the interface was like it came out of a monkey's butt.
Anyway I have the PS3 so I felt I had to preorder it. I will try my best to like it. :)
Hehe, my track record with FF games is pretty bad as well. I played FF8 on the PC and grew tired of the game by the end of the third disc and I never finished it. I've started FF7 on the PS3 and am about 8 hours into it but I haven't played it recently. Hopefully I will have more luck with FFXIII.
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Let's see I have played and beaten FF3, FF7, and FF10. I got to the very end of FF8 but never finished it since like iPPi mentions, it does get boring. I also played a chunk of FF6, I liked it but stopped playing it. I have FF12 and gotten a little ways into it, its a great game, just one of those I got distracted off of. Awesome part about all this however is that FF games are self-contained separate stories from each other. So you can start anywhere!
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I finished FF1, most of Mystic Quest, most of 5, all of 6, 7, 8, and 9. After that I just lost interest. Somewhere around the time FFX came out I realized it was the same design over and over, and I no longer was interested in the anime style and the androgynous characters. It was also around that time that I discovered some old Amano art of characters from FF6, and I couldn't tell the men from the women. It's a weird Japanese cultural thing that makes no sense to me as a Westerner. I just find it unappealing.
I was listening to the Bombcast today and they were talking about the "feel" of Japanese games, in relation to Dead Rising 2 and Lost Planet 2. They said Dead Rising has a very deliberate way of letting the animations play out fully when you attack something, which makes you lose control of your character in a dangerous way, because you can get attacked while stuck in a longer animation. It's a sacrifice of gameplay for visuals. They then talked about how Lost Planet, while cool, controlled really strangely because of the way the characters moved, which made it feel distinctly like a Japanese game. They went on to talk about how including Gears characters seems like a bad idea, since it will just remind people that there's a similar 3rd person shooter out there that controls way better, and you could be playing that instead.
All of this combined is why I just avoid Japanese games in general these days. I assume if something's from a Japanese developer it will have one or more of the following:
-annoyingly anime characters
-squeaky japanese voices or really bad english voices
-poor gameplay/controls
-over the top flashy graphics that obscure what's going on
-androgynous teenage male characters
-wardrobes that look like something from a bad fashion show
I just feel like Japanese developers don't get it anymore. Like they're out of touch somehow. I guess it's just me moving on and realizing that the quirky Japanese stuff that defined gaming for so long, is part of their culture, and to me it's just fucking weird now.
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Poor controls, and a prehistoric interface and presentation is what makes Japanese games so nauseating to me. It is why for the longest time I found console gaming in general so laughable.
What I don't understand is this inability to grow. Cobra is right.. it is an arrogant attitude.
Games like Resident Evil and Silent Hill are ridiculous to me.
Let's make a broken and limited interface, with nonsensical controls and camera movement... and call it part of the atmosphere.
I think a lot of this has to be Stockholm Syndrome or something... it is the only way I can explain the minority not bothered by this anymore.
Look, it was fine 15 years ago, when technology was limited and those style of games were still young. But any of those Resident Evil/Silent Hill games released in the past ten years that have those issues don't have an excuse.
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I wouldn't be surprised if it's the arrogance that drives most of the stagnation. I've been led to believe that the Japanese are a very arrogant people. who at one time held the belief that they were the "master race", which even resulted in not letting outsiders even into port for trade. With this type of mindset being passed down through the generations, you could easily see why they don't want to follow trends of westerners in an industry that the likes of Nintendo and Sony (Japanese companies) built throughout the 80s and 90s. That's why the Xbox and Xbox 360 seld (and still sell) laughably in Japan. It's not because of lack of the right games or marketing. It's because Japanese people are racist against anyone not Japanese.
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Fucking hell, what did this thread turn into?
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From what I understand Fallout 3 is a better game than Oblivion. It seems to have less freedom, but at the same time the optional stuff is better written.
Anyway you might find this interesting:
http://kotaku.com/5475175/alan-wake-used-to-be-an-open+world-game
Regarding the long debate, it isn't really one, at least in my eyes, because I don't see one as better than the other. I think they are equally important, but I obviously prefer western RPGs to JRPGs. I would rather there be an open world, but with more focused gameplay. So much of the content in Oblivion was undercooked... yes I put a 100 hours into the game, but still. :P
I think this is why I loved games like Deus Ex and Baldur's Gate II so much. Both the games (the the latter a lot more so than the former) were pretty damn huge, but there was so much attention to detail.
Regarding the smug attitude, you may remember this from Bioware:
http://news.cnet.com/8301-13506_3-10419828-17.html
But yea I do agree with you.
What angered me somewhat was when some prominent Japanese developer said after the release of Bioshock that western developers were finally getting better than the Japanese ones.
That ticked me off, becaue he proceeded to name games which had already been franchises on the PC.
I just wanted to shake him and say, no you idiot, they've always been better... you just didn't bother playing the games.
I've sunk hundreds of hours into both games, and both offer the same degree of freedom. The exceptions are rare, with certain sequences you have to get through once you start in FO3. The vast majority of the time, you can be working on multiple quests at your leisure, dropping one to go do something else that suddenly strikes your fancy (and then return to the quest later). Broken Steel addressed the issue of the game coming to a grinding halt after the main quest line is completed. The world now continues indefinitely. The story is rich and compelling, but you are not wrenched out of the game world and tied to a TV chair to learn it. You pick it up by learning it through your own exploration and NPC interactions. More importantly, you determine the story through your actions. There are multiple possibilities, at least 2 per individual turning point. You are never forced to do anything. It's all up to you, including who lives and who dies. You are the master of your destiny, within the limitations of what exists before you.
After that experience, reading what I quoted about FF XIII flatly pissed me off. That guy is so far up his own ass that he can't see what's what. Fuck him and his game.
Everything you said, and that quote are spot-on. Great post, Pug.
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I know there is definitely a lot of nationalism in Japan, but I think the consumer mindset is entirely different, and it isn't a case of racism. Just look at their culture, and the sort of games they play... those type of games are definitely a rarity on the Xbox.
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Square Enix is saying FFXIII is NOT a RPG. (http://www.1up.com/do/previewPage?cId=3178060)
:o
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Finally, they admit it. :P
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With FFXIII, we've first and foremost pursued a gameplay style in which different situations and dramatic occurrences will be presented to players one after the other."
In other words, FFXIII has taken yet another step closer to becoming the "interactive movie" detractors have waggishly derided the series as being ever since 1997's dazzlingly cinematic Final Fantasy VII -- and the creators are perfectly happy with that step.
More suited to Netflix than a console. Great.
Edit: Wait. There's more.
Kitase and Toriyama are determined to give gamers a lush, cinematic experience, and to that end they've severely limited player freedom to minimize the possibility that you might encounter a blemish.
Silly players, wanting to decide what to do.
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Ugh this is ridiculous. Its a fucking FF game, not a goddamn Bethesda game. Have a fucking clue.
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hahahahah...
I don't know why that made me laugh.
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Ha! Yeah, I got a chuckle too.
The point I've been pushing can very much be summed up as Bethesda vs Squaresoft game design. I don't know if Pyro aimed his comment at me or the linked article. I find the criticism valid, particularly because the dev is confirming it with a straight face. I've never liked games that lead me by the nose and sacrifice player freedom for a story better served by a miniseries. I have played all or part of several games in the FF series too, starting with VI, and later backtracking to a fan translation of V. But it's what happened with VII and beyond that gets so troubling. I thought they had grown past that with XII, but now it seems they consider XII to be a step in the wrong direction. What a pity.
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I definitely think there is a space for both type of games. The linear RPGs bring tighter narrative, while the more open RPGs offer a greater sense of freedom.
My issue isn't with the style of Final Fantasy, but with the lack of growth in other areas like the interface and overall presentation. Little seems to have changed from what I have seen. I think that FF can show plenty of growth without compromising its very linear style.
Anyway, I am definitely going to be buying this one and hope to finish it. :)
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Whew, I was a bit irritated last night and comment just came out, glad I didn't piss anyone off, haha.
Anyway, my point really is that I have no problems with FF games, there game design may be different, but I don't think its bad. Triple A games are falling in this action/adventure FPS/Third person only domain, even RPGs are molding to that genre. Even some ways it looks like FFXIII is growing more into that, but how often to FF games get released, every 4 or 5 years? Certainly there's room on the table for FF's game design. We should like, even demand more variety in these big titles. If your not into it, there's certainly plenty more around of what your used to.
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My irritation comes from the grand expectations I had for XIII after having such a great experience with XII. That one was heavy with story too, but it felt so open most of the time, and featured in-world real-time* combat. Those expectations got dashed to the ground hard. Yeah, I know I have other choices. I really wanted XIII to be among them, one of the best. Not to be; not for me.
* (Yes, I know dice were being rolled behind the scenes. It still felt very immersive, in real time. Tactical footwork while recharging powers was truly real-time anyway.)
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My irritation comes from the grand expectations I had for XIII after having such a great experience with XII. That one was heavy with story too, but it felt so open most of the time, and featured in-world real-time* combat. Those expectations got dashed to the ground hard. Yeah, I know I have other choices. I really wanted XIII to be among them, one of the best. Not to be; not for me.
* (Yes, I know dice were being rolled behind the scenes. It still felt very immersive, in real time. Tactical footwork while recharging powers was truly real-time anyway.)
Fuck, you're making me want to play it again.
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As a huge fan of XII, I can definitely understand that frustration. I don't really know what to think of all this. I'll just wait for it to come out and for someone else to play it and let me know what it's really like in the end.
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I simply don't understand why there's so much hate for this game. There's like this preconception that if it isn't an open world game or if it doesn't follow the traditional formula than this game will be absolute garbage.
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My irritation comes from the grand expectations I had for XIII after having such a great experience with XII. That one was heavy with story too, but it felt so open most of the time, and featured in-world real-time* combat. Those expectations got dashed to the ground hard. Yeah, I know I have other choices. I really wanted XIII to be among them, one of the best. Not to be; not for me.
* (Yes, I know dice were being rolled behind the scenes. It still felt very immersive, in real time. Tactical footwork while recharging powers was truly real-time anyway.)
Which proves my point, I dont want an FF game to go more in that direction. I don't want real time combat or open world, I've already played dozens of games that do that. The points that have been raised here was how big headed easterners are with their games, but we're sitting here expecting they conformed to a more western gaming market, why should they? I think Square is one of the rare few that still manages to bring appeal to Japanese games, its what makes them what they are. Besides if you want open world FF then go play the MMO, which I was against them doing in the first place. You complain about long cutscene sequences, but for some reason you didn't mind reading long periods of text boxes in pre PS2 era FFs.
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I'm in agreement with pyro. this is what final fantasy is to me:
- cinematic style
- great story
- turn based combat
when you broaden the scope of a game, you are in danger of diluting certain aspects of it. ff games are what they are and massively succesful because of it.
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OK, fair enough. Different expectations will lead to polar-opposite assessments of the game. If you want a return to the more linear and turn-based earlier games, then you will be a lot more pleased than I will.
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yeah, probably - especially given that i didn't really like ffxii all that much. i thought the dynamic battle system sucked. hard. once you got to a certain point in the game, 90%+ of all fights played automatically. also, i felt the usual focus on story was missing - it didn't feel as dramatic as it's predecessors, i felt like a cog in a political machine i didn't really care about, rather than a main player. by the end of the game, i really didn't give a shit what happened. the only thing i preferred about it was the free roaming - but i'd happily sacrifice that in favour of everything else that i enjoyed so much from the previous iterations.
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Gamespot's Import Friendly (http://www.gamespot.com/ps3/rpg/finalfantasy13/video/6248840/import-friendly-final-fantasy-xiii?nonRedirectElement=1) had some good coverage on the FFXIII (as well as Valkyria Chronicles 2 on PSP near the end).
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Congrats Playstation... for once you have the superior product:
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-final-fantasy-xiii-face-off
Good thing I was getting this on the PS3 anyway.
Very rarely are you asked to return to previous locations - with just one chapter in the game dedicated to the sort of free-roaming JPRG gameplay for which Final Fantasy is renowned.
Strange... I had no idea they made things that much more linear. Anyway, I am getting a little excited for this game.
I haven't actually touched my Jasper 360 since they day I bought it after my old one died.
However, experienced eyes out there know a legit shot when they see one, and soon the Xbox 360 version was being reported as 1024x576, with 2x multi-sampling anti-aliasing. This is up against native 720p on the original PlayStation 3 version, again with the same 2x level of MSAA, representing a fairly enormous drop of around a third of the overall resolution. So, are the stories about a reduced resolution on FFXIII 360 true? You betcha.
(http://www.mazingerdude.com/FF13_lighting_PS3.jpg).
(http://www.mazingerdude.com/FF13_lighting_360.jpg)
edit:
The difference is more striking when you are looking at these images on a full page rather than the downsized versions on OW.
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Despite the cutbacks, the in-game graphics are still attractive, the gameplay is fundamentally the same as the PS3 version and it's clearly a cut-above much of the other JPRG fare available on the console. That being the case, despite falling short in direct comparison with its PS3 sibling it's still a decent game, though I daresay that the retooling of the formula into a more linear experience with obvious cutbacks in the exploration element is likely to frustrate many of the core fanbase.
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eh, the resolution drop and compressed movies bothers me a little, but nowhere near enough to buy a new console.
i'm still anticipating this game a great deal, but based on some of the reviews, i'm also anticipating being slightly dissapointed. it is one of those games where i really need to play for myself though.
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There are some videos on that website, and it looks incredible regardless of the console. I definitely agree that the differences aren't enough to buy a new console of course.
Yea it is disappointing that they've cut back on the exploration portions of the game, but final fantasy is now seemingly one of a kind. I mean in the past you had games like Skies of Arcadia, Grandia etc., but those days seem to be over.
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That being the case, despite falling short in direct comparison with its PS3 sibling it's still a decent game, though I daresay that the retooling of the formula into a more linear experience with obvious cutbacks in the exploration element is likely to frustrate many of the core fanbase.
That's the deficiency which will keep me away, not the graphics. It can't be cured by buying a PS3 either.
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Final Fantasy 13 reviews rolling in:
http://www.videogamer.com/ps3/final_fantasy_xiii/review.html
After 20 hours, Final Fantasy XIII granted me permission to decide for myself which three playable characters should be in my party. After 25 hours, Final Fantasy XIII granted me permission to decide for myself how I should develop the characters in my party. After 30 hours, Final Fantasy XIII decided to let go of my hand, but then thought better of it and grabbed hold of it again. Welcome to the evolution of the Japanese role-playing game.
Yikes.
Well, it's true: FFXIII is linear. So linear, in fact, that for the first ten chapters - approximately 20 hours of gameplay - FFXIII feels more like a dungeon crawler than an epic, expansive JRPG. There are no side-quests to add variety. There are no towns or villages to visit. There is no over world to explore. You move forward, fight, fight, and fight, then sit back and watch a cutscene, then do it all again, pushing ever forward, never deviating from the straight and narrow path upon which you must tread. At the end of a chapter, there's a boss fight, which is usually a pretty horrendous difficulty spike, then, a cutscene, and the next part of the tunnel. The Final Fantasy series, and indeed the JRPG genre, has always been a somewhat linear experience, punctuated by turn-based combat and beautiful CGI cutscenes, and driven by melodramatic narrative. But FFXIII is so linear that it feels like you're adventuring through one long, dark tunnel, and there's no light at the end of it to give you hope that at some point your journey will change course.
Huh? No towns? No areas to openly explore?
I've played a good chunk of FF8 and watched my friends play through tons of other FF games, and this just doesn't sound like Final Fantasy.
It's a deliberate design decision on producer Yoshinori Kitase and co's part, of course - an effort to lend the game what director Momotu Toriyama calls an "FPS style vibe". He's obviously been playing the scripted Modern Warfare series and taken notes. But the team's gone too far in its efforts to evolve the tried and trusted - some say tired - Final Fantasy formula. The result is a sanitised, uninspiring, monotonous trudge through admittedly fabulous-looking surroundings. It's as if you are being driven to the end of the game as you sleep in the back seat.
Other design decisions only serve to exacerbate the feeling that you're never truly in control of what's happening. The game dictates who is on the front line of your party - i.e., who fights in battles - for the first 20 hours of the game
Now, you may wish to sit down for what's coming next: you only ever control one character during combat. We know, madness, huh? What has Square Enix done? Why have you dumbed down FF for the casual noobs! Calm down, dear. It's actually really good. Yes, you only control one character at once, but, with the Paradigm Shift function, you indirectly control everyone, and the AI is really, really good.
FFXIII's combat system is the best the series has seen. It's exciting to watch, fun to use, and, most importantly, brimming with strategy and depth
Story is, of course, massively important for Final Fantasy fans. The great news is that in this regard you won't be disappointed
And then of course, there are the graphics. FFXIII - the first HD FF game - looks fantastic. The in-game character models are superb. Lightning's hair blows in the wind, Snow's jacket ripples realistically as he dishes out his unique blend of knuckle sandwich, and Sazh's afro… well, it wobbles about like jelly, which isn't realistic at all, but from a distance it looks great. Some of the environments look stunning, too.
And then of course, there are the graphics. FFXIII - the first HD FF game - looks fantastic. The in-game character models are superb. Lightning's hair blows in the wind, Snow's jacket ripples realistically as he dishes out his unique blend of knuckle sandwich, and Sazh's afro… well, it wobbles about like jelly, which isn't realistic at all, but from a distance it looks great. Some of the environments look stunning, too.
But the CGI cutscenes will no doubt steal the show. They are, quite simply, the best ever; to our eyes as good as the Final Fantasy CGI movies. There are loads of cutscenes in FFXIII, but they are not, in isolation, offensively long, as they are in MGS4. They are bite-sized chunks of animated brilliance, and demand to be watched over and over again. But the more impressive feat is how good the "in between cutscenes" look. These cutscenes - not CGI but not in-game - look fantastic, and sometimes fool you into thinking you're watching CGI. There can be no doubt that FFXIII is a graphical feast worthy of anyone's high definition television.
Despite the superb battle system, engaging cutscenes, and interesting characters, FFXIII, ultimately, is a disappointment. Taken in isolation, it is a fun game with stunning graphics and a compelling story. But compared with the wider RPG genre, and held up against the lofty expectations of the series' hardcore fans, it falls short. For this reason, newcomers may well enjoy FFXIII more than series' veterans.
That's good news for me I guess?
You just can't escape the feeling that, in trimming the fat from the series, Square Enix has nicked FFXIII's bone. It's not a bad game by any stretch of the imagination; like a good song, or a slow-burning book, FFXIII grows on you the more you play it. It is, undoubtedly, the best JRPG to come out of Square Enix in a long time. But the inescapable, uncomfortable truth is that it is too linear. Without traditional JRPG features like towns, NPCs, and an over world, there is no real sense of ownership. Upon completing the game, you certainly feel as if you've enjoyed the 50 or so hours you've invested into doing so, but the experience is more throwaway than formative. Despite some incredibly tough monster hunting missions in chapter 11, there's no variation to the game whatsoever.
FFXIII spends too long easing players into its complex systems - complex systems which, really, aren't that complex. In a recent interview, Kitase said: "It's better to see some people be a little bit bored" than give players too much information to digest. We had no idea he was talking about 25 hours of boredom. Toriyama recently said that lower than expected review scores are the result of press reviewing "from a western point of view", as if to say we're missing the point. But surely, in today's global village and instant communication age, taking a global perspective on a high profile internationally-released video game is the only proper course of action.
As Western role-playing games have evolved, delving into open world, player-driven territory (Elder Scrolls, Fallout) and cinematic, cross-genre experiences (Mass Effect, Borderlands), Japanese role-playing games have remained largely the same - stuck in a rut, even - telling tales of teenage angst and upbeat heroic fantasy we've heard countless times before. We're not saying we wanted Final Fantasy to copy WRPG mechanics. We simply wanted - quite desperately - for Final Fantasy XIII to be the best JRPG of all time. You have to hand it to Square Enix for trying to move things forward - better that than yet another rehash of the tried and tested Final Fantasy formula (the less said about Infinite Undiscovery the better). But it does so along a path so narrow and straight that you long for the days of old. When Vanille is knocked out in battle, she sometimes says: "What went wrong?" It's a question we find ourselves wondering as well.
I've never been to videogamer.com but that review was really well written, and constructed. Having said that, I will still get this game the day it is released and form my own opinion.
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Gamespot gives it an 8.5:
There are some elements that keep Final Fantasy XIII from being everything it could have been. Even so, it is still a legitimately great game for its stunning beauty, fantastic story, and enjoyable battles, which means it has a lot in common with the Final Fantasy games that came before it. The stubborn gal in the blue sari, the steely blue-eyed star, and even the apprehensive, spiky-haired adolescent are easy to root for, and their journey is as memorable as any other in the series. Even if the gameplay doesn't reach those same heights, almost any RPG lover can still get lost in Final Fantasy XIII.
The good news is he likes it. The bad news is that it is Kevin Van0rd.
1UP gives it an A- :
Like Mass Effect 2, FFXIII seems to be an attempt to answer the question of how to create an RPG for the modern, console-owning masses. Square Enix's solution is certainly different than BioWare's, but it's arguably just as effective in its own way. I can't say that this is the direction I want the genre as a whole to go -- or even the Final Fantasy series, for that matter -- but Square should be commended for embarking on an interesting journey down a daring road when so many of their competitors are content to stand, directionless, back at the crossroads.
Doesn't sound like he is completely convinced, which is strange when he gives it an A-.
Gameinformer gives it a 9.25:
A good story is of paramount importance in a role-playing game, but the fact that FF XIII’s other elements compensate for its disappointing narrative is a testament to the overall quality of the experience. For years, gamers have had visions of this title as an industry-transforming epiphany, but no game could possibly live up to such astronomical expectations. That’s no reason to lose faith; though reality doesn’t match the myth, Final Fantasy XIII is a phenomenal RPG destined to be remembered as a technical milestone for the series.
Eurogamer gives it an 8.0:
Still, Final Fantasy XIII's is a superb system overall, easily making up what depth it has lost in speed, tactical cunning and moment-to-moment engagement. Some have bemoaned the apparent retreat from XII's daring reinvention - I did myself, at first - but in its way XIII is just as big a step for the party RPG, albeit a simpler and perhaps more palatable one.
Palatable is very much the word for Final Fantasy XIII. The Final Fantasy series, with its lengthy cinematics, stubborn style and carefully prescribed limitations, can never hope to please everyone. So it's strange to see it try, and no surprise that the result is not a total success. It's cautious, narrow, far too slow to get going, and is stripped down to such a bare naked form that even some FF traditionalists might find it off-putting.
What's left, though, is faultlessly accomplished, gorgeous to behold and, in the long run, thoroughly enjoyable. For better or worse, it's another new beginning, and that's one Final Fantasy tradition that should never be changed.
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FFXIII spends too long easing players into its complex systems - complex systems which, really, aren't that complex. In a recent interview, Kitase said: "It's better to see some people be a little bit bored" than give players too much information to digest. We had no idea he was talking about 25 hours of boredom. Toriyama recently said that lower than expected review scores are the result of press reviewing "from a western point of view", as if to say we're missing the point. But surely, in today's global village and instant communication age, taking a global perspective on a high profile internationally-released video game is the only proper course of action.
That paragraph really stood out for me. It seems to nail the issue squarely (oooh . . . sorry).
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Either way I'm still interested, regardless of its linearity. Hell, Heavy Rain is completely linear and it's still a blast. Whether a game is linear or not should not be a deterrent. I think what's getting people is because it's a departure from the traditional Final Fantasy game. I guess I'm not ingrained on their previous games at all so I have no problem with a change in design philosophy.
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Toriyama recently said that lower than expected review scores are the result of press reviewing "from a western point of view", as if to say we're missing the point.
That sounds rather contradicting since they were trying to cater to a western audience in the first place.
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I have to say, after reading some reviews, this game really shows how broken gaming journalists are. I mean this is just bad. The reviewers aren't giving scores based on how they feel, but because of the name on the product and backlash.
I'm seeing 4/5 stars and 8/10 when they sound more like 6/10 or 3/5.
Grow some fucking balls and rate it how it is. Man this is upsetting. I know it always sort of been there to some extent, but this really is the prime example where its ugly face cannot be ignored.
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That sounds rather contradicting since they were trying to cater to a western audience in the first place.
Square Enix is not catering to a Western-RPG audience here, I don't think. Western-RPG gamers like wide-open RPG's where you have the whole at your disposal (Elder Scrolls, Fallout series) and/or RPG's that open-up the world as you go along with good deals of choice and decision-making in their games that will matter (Witcher, Dragon Age, Mass Effect).
I really am not sure what Square-Enix is aiming here for w/ FF13. It seems odd to me they have removed completely towns and world exploring found in earlier FF games - I always thought those were the nice breaks to take and get more out of the story and immersed into the gameworld, to get you away from the grinding and leveling-up for a bit. FF13 is starting to sound more like a linear game that just flows in one direction than ever before - like your typical strategy old-school FPS. I don't know, but come to think of it - it seems like Square-Enix seems to be making it more like a linear strategy game and less of a RPG.
EDIT:
GTTV review - 8.6 from GTTV. (http://www.gametrailers.com/video/review-final-fantasy/62719)
Hmmm...so you do your shopping at Save Points now in FF13? That sounds a lot like having vending machines being where you buy items and equipment in the gameworld - i.e. Bioshock and Borderlands.
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This should be at the store in a few days and I am really quite excited for it.
I'm seeing 4/5 stars and 8/10 when they sound more like 6/10 or 3/5.
The thing is that their reviews aren't written well enough to express that they are disappointed with how the game compares to its predecessors, but on the whole is still good enough to take a score of 4 out of 5 or an 8 out of 10.
The reason some of these reviews seem so negative is because they are comparing the product to the ideal, which is why the reader would think the reviewer would give it a score of something like 5 out of 10, when the games are still better than actual games that fall into that bracket.
A lot of reviewers have a different process of writing reviews and deciding scores. When deciding on a score, you basically compare the game to something of a similar genre, which you or your publication (if you wish to main consistency with the website/magazine you are writing for) reviewed.
For example, say someone was really disappointed with Far Cry 2, and wrote a mostly negative review... they could still feel that the game was better than other shooters they have given scores in the 70 percentile, even if they were quite disappointed.
It actually comes down to the skill of the writer. He has to be able to express why he is disappointed, but what still makes the game worth a score of 4/5 or 80%
One final thing. The majority of the writers who I have noticed disappointed with FF13, have still gone on to state that it is still one of the best offerings on the Xbox 360/PS3.
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I have to say, after reading some reviews, this game really shows how broken gaming journalists are. I mean this is just bad. The reviewers aren't giving scores based on how they feel, but because of the name on the product and backlash.
I'm seeing 4/5 stars and 8/10 when they sound more like 6/10 or 3/5.
Grow some fucking balls and rate it how it is. Man this is upsetting. I know it always sort of been there to some extent, but this really is the prime example where its ugly face cannot be ignored.
Heh. I see what you mean. (http://www.metacritic.com/games/platforms/ps3/finalfantasy13) If you work your way up the list, you get near the 90s before you stop seeing criticism serious enough to drop the scores lower.
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4 stars from GameSpy (out of 5). (http://ps3.gamespy.com/playstation-3/final-fantasy-xiii/1074815p1.html)
Thank goodness for the battle system, then, because it saves the game while you're wincing through the saccharine banter and waiting for the training wheels to spin off.
IGN's impressions, some 30 hours into it. (http://ps3.ign.com/articles/107/1074843p1.html)
As a quick note for owners of multiple platforms, I strongly recommend getting this game on the PS3. The 360 version seems to run well enough, but it's noticeably less sharp and is spread across three discs.
Check back Monday for my full review.
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Players are not allowed to choose their party or party leader -- these selections are dictated by the story progression. Although this might be a tremendous pain to some gamers, I actually enjoyed the linearity and restrictions, because it forced me to experiment with all the characters and their various battle roles.
This confuses me a little. He enjoyed the linearity in choosing his party because it allowed him the freedom to experiment with the party? I don't understand.
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This confuses me a little. He enjoyed the linearity in choosing his party because it allowed him the freedom to experiment with the party? I don't understand.
Hmmm...maybe it has to do w/ the experimentation on the Paradigm Shifts and Role Switching?
I dunno...
*shrug*
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Sure he could be enjoying those things... but how does the linearity allow him to enjoy those things more?
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Sure he could be enjoying those things... but how does the linearity allow him to enjoy those things more?
Maybe he would've stuck w/ the top 3 party members if the game didn't force stuff on him?
Who knows...
*shrug*
I dunno, but Bioware has been known to use the same tactics in some games - see KOTOR and DAO. At certain points and certain areas, they may just force ONE certain party member into the area/quest.
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Yea, but that's normally related to a plot point or something.
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In my experience with all FF games, speculation will get me nowhere because they're too abstract to properly convey. I really have to play it thoroughly first then come to a solid conclusion. I think that's safe to say for any Square Enix game.
P.S. I am currently replaying FFVIII on PSP since I never did finish it.
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Square Enix is not catering to a Western-RPG audience here, I don't think. Western-RPG gamers like wide-open RPG's where you have the whole at your disposal (Elder Scrolls, Fallout series) and/or RPG's that open-up the world as you go along with good deals of choice and decision-making in their games that will matter (Witcher, Dragon Age, Mass Effect).
I really am not sure what Square-Enix is aiming here for w/ FF13. It seems odd to me they have removed completely towns and world exploring found in earlier FF games - I always thought those were the nice breaks to take and get more out of the story and immersed into the gameworld, to get you away from the grinding and leveling-up for a bit. FF13 is starting to sound more like a linear game that just flows in one direction than ever before - like your typical strategy old-school FPS. I don't know, but come to think of it - it seems like Square-Enix seems to be making it more like a linear strategy game and less of a RPG.
EDIT:
GTTV review - 8.6 from GTTV. (http://www.gametrailers.com/video/review-final-fantasy/62719)
Hmmm...so you do your shopping at Save Points now in FF13? That sounds a lot like having vending machines being where you buy items and equipment in the gameworld - i.e. Bioshock and Borderlands.
No they were going more western with it, they just went another way with it. Instead of going more RPG, they wanted something more like what the triple A third person and first person games felt like. Just trying to broaden their audience with it.
It's a deliberate design decision on producer Yoshinori Kitase and co's part, of course - an effort to lend the game what director Momotu Toriyama calls an "FPS style vibe". He's obviously been playing the scripted Modern Warfare series and taken notes.
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I feel way too badly about not finishing 12 to purchase 13.
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Yeah, I really want to get into playing IX or XII again.
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I still haven't finished XII just because I like the bastard too much. One of these days, when I have a PS2 again.
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got my copy a little bit early and have just started it up - thought i'd just give a quick opinion on the 360 version visuals.
resolution looks fine. i'm playing this about 5 feet away from a 37" full-HD set, and it looks good. the drop in resolution is not something i would have noticed if it hadn't been pointed out. the fmv sections look good too. when there's a lot of motion, it looses some crispness, but it's not something i'd point out as a real flaw.
the thing that does look bad, however, is the hair. it looks grainy, as if it needs an alpha blended transparency, or something. really pulls you out of the "is this fmv, or realtime?" double take. it's not a major issue, but it's slightly irritating all the same.
ok. i will now play more than the first 20 minutes and give some further impressions in a bit...
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I just came home with the game. It is actually the most expensive regular edition game I've ever purchased, at $78, which is just insane. I am not sure why it was so expensive... perhaps because it came from the UK rather than Hong Kong.
Anyway, I will give it a go in a few hours.
edit:
Had a bit of time, so played for 15 minutes.
The game really does look incredible. The art is brilliant... it is some weird but cool futuristic setting... looks stunning with a great blend of sexalicious colors that almost have this gunmetal tinge to them. It is easily the best looking game I've played on the PS3, even better than the God of War demo and probably better than most PC games I've played. The CGI is like something out of a movie.
The gameplay I can tell I will enjoy a lot...
From what I've played so far, the gameplay is nothing like standard Final Fantasy fare. It has been till now quite simplistic, which probably suits me fine considering the last FF game I played was FF8, and it was on the PC.
For now, I am able to only control the main character, and my sidekick is AI controlled.
Will report more in a couple of hours.
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My copy shipped but will probably arrive at the end of the week or early next week.
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AOL Radio is currently streaming FF13's Soundtrack.
Enjoy. (http://www.destructoid.com/aol-radio-has-final-fantasy-xiii-s-soundtrack-streaming-166309.phtml)
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I came across this review somewhere along the way in the past couple days. It's pretty long as these things go, but there's a short version which I imagine doesn't ramble and rant so much.
http://www.actionbutton.net/?p=630
I've never heard of this site and I imagine it's a start up that took the opportunity of a huge game to try and make a name for itself, but it's an interesting article. Basically they make the game sound like a giant collage of artistic masturbation slapped together into a game and seems like a valid point from what I've seen.
Square is getting a ton of backlash for this game. It'll be worth seeing if, despite that, they still come out ahead and with enough goodwill to continue the series without becoming something of a joke like Dynasty Warriors. I get the impression that they were told they can do no wrong and that they single-handedly put Sony on the gaming map with FFVII for so long that they fell into some sort of self-insulating bubble. That bubble has finally collapsed on itself and Square seems worse off than they were a decade ago.
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8.9 from IGN for PS3 and X360.
Video review. (http://ps3.ign.com/dor/objects/826843/final-fantasy-xiii/videos/ff13_vdr_030810.html)
Written review. (http://ps3.ign.com/articles/107/1075772p1.html)
GameZone
GameZone -> 8.5 (out of 10) (http://ps3.gamezone.com/gzreviews/r29637.htm)
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http://www.actionbutton.net/?p=630
Eventually, the game gives you the world, and it looks nice, like a game you’d like to play, if only you had the time. Waiting 28 hours to finally let you choose your party / leader / job is like dating a girl for nine years before trusting her with the key to your apartment. During the time you spend with this game, you will utter sentences like “Hm. He has a pretty uncomplicated Blaster Crystarium.”
Holy crap - 28 hours until the game actually opens up its gameworld and battle system? :o
I can understand games like DAO and KOTOR that mix things up now and again by say forcing party members into your party for story reasons for a short period of time (usually a few quests); or say letting you unlock areas as you go along or reach a certain character level...but, geez...FF13 sounds maddening w/ going from one extreme to another.
...Why does it sound like FF13 is two different games here? :o
EDIT:
I also got this impression w/ the IGN review.
The first 25 to 30 hours of the game are so linear, they might as well be on rails. Dungeons are nothing more than a series of pathways through various environments, with occasional detours hiding a floating treasure chest. This linearity wasn't particularly bothersome for me because I was enjoying the story and battles along the way, but this will be a huge blow to Final Fantasy veterans.
It's important to note that the game does open up quite a bit in Chapter 11 (out of 13), giving players the freedom to explore several huge environments and undertake tons of side missions. For some, this will be a classic case of "too little, too late." Exacerbating this issue is the fact that players are unable to select their party leader and party members before Chapter 10.
EDIT #2:
Now, this is REALLY interesting to me (http://kotaku.com/5446974/interview-there-is-enough-discarded-final-fantasy-xiii-to-make-another-game), which was embedded somewhere within that rant-city ActionButton.Net review.
Remember, Square Enix has no plans for DLC. (http://kotaku.com/5471819/square-enix-has-no-plans-for-final-fantasy-xiii-dlc?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+kotaku%2Ffull+%28Kotaku%29)
If they think there's enough content for another full FF game - geez, there must be a shit-ton of content there - maybe this cut-content will wind up taken and polished into some sort of a FFXIII-2? Especially if FF13 itself is successful?
Who the heck knows....Just a thought...
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The point in the article is a good one. If there's that much "spare" content, it just shows that Square threw crap together without a thought of an overall feel/story/world.
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I came across this review somewhere along the way in the past couple days. It's pretty long as these things go, but there's a short version which I imagine doesn't ramble and rant so much.
http://www.actionbutton.net/?p=630
I've never heard of this site and I imagine it's a start up that took the opportunity of a huge game to try and make a name for itself, but it's an interesting article. Basically they make the game sound like a giant collage of artistic masturbation slapped together into a game and seems like a valid point from what I've seen.
Square is getting a ton of backlash for this game. It'll be worth seeing if, despite that, they still come out ahead and with enough goodwill to continue the series without becoming something of a joke like Dynasty Warriors. I get the impression that they were told they can do no wrong and that they single-handedly put Sony on the gaming map with FFVII for so long that they fell into some sort of self-insulating bubble. That bubble has finally collapsed on itself and Square seems worse off than they were a decade ago.
Holy fuck. No offence, but I sincerely tried to read that and just couldn't. The writing blew, which is amazing because you could feel how hard they were trying to be unique and cleaver rather than just shitty. Also, the formatting...what the fuck is up with the formatting? There could be good points there, but....just damn. I gave up after the fourth micro paragraph in a row was still talking about Final Fantasy XII.
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I actually really liked it. Not perfect, but it was still pretty good. Just don't try to read it all at once.
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It just seemed all over the place and hard to read. To be fair, I could just be really tired.
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Well I put my first 6 hours into it so far and I'm liking it so far. Yeah the areas are a little more linear than previous games but its still fun. I'm really liking Paradigm Shift. It's pretty cool to be able to change you and your party member's roles on the fly. It seems like a refined, simplified version of the gambit system from FFXII. The story started off with lots of action and hasn't let up too much so far. I'll post more detailed impressions later.
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I read the short version (http://www.actionbutton.net/?p=631). Scathing, to be sure. Part of the writer's problem is that he is using too many similes, trying to be clever, I suppose.
You walk a tightrope for thirty hours before the game groans, gives in, and says, “Okay, you can have fun now“. Waiting thirty hours before letting you choose your own party leader is like dating a girl for nine years before trusting her with a key to your apartment.
It adds too much bulk to the article, though that particular point seems to be universal across reviews.
I guess it's too early to get players here to give me an answer to my question. Are the negative reviews way off, or are the big commercial game publications afraid to downvote a Final Fantasy game? It must be one or the other, because a game as bad as this review portrays couldn't possibly get honest high marks from experienced professional reviewers.
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i can see where the negative feedback is coming from, but i don't really agree with it. would you rate a racing simulation game down because you can't use nitrous, blow up other players, or any number of other things that are not part of the games intention? i think some people wanted this to be another game entirely. i'm not a rabid ff fanboy by any means, i wasn't a big fan of x-2, or xii - but this one i'm really digging.
yes, there's little freedom. yes, the game opens up slowly. no, this is not an open world game. but to counter that, throughout the hand holding and linear path, there is a fantastic story, with beautiful visuals and a superb battle system.
after reading some of the reviews, i was ready to be disappointed. pleasantly i am not. in fact, 15 hours in, i am completely loving it.
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Holy crap!
5 million shipped of FF13 so far since its release in Japan in December 2009.
That so far brings it up to about 96 million copies shipped for the FF franchise. (http://www.shacknews.com/onearticle.x/62733)
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Shipped, not sold.
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Shipped, not sold.
*Re-reads*
Oops.
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All the negative criticism is because of the preconception that this game must follow the same design path and gameplay style of the previous Final Fantasy games. It's as if people want to play FFVII or XII again, but in HD. The fact of the matter though is that it isn't your typical Final Fantasy game and people can't seem to wrap their heads around that concept. If you wanted FFVII or XII again then maybe you should just replay those instead.
Nearly all the reviews state that the game is fun, but was disappointed because it isn't open world like the previous Final Fantasy games. All the FF games tell a self contained story that doesn't overlap with the other games (generally speaking). I just don't see why people keep comparing it to the previous games. If it didn't have the Final Fantasy title, I wonder how the reception of this game would have been.
And while everybody is hating on it, I log into PSN and every single friend online is playing FFXIII.
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Same thing happened a lot with XII too, though, remember. "Omg, it isn't FFVII2, kill it with fire". I made a lot of the same arguments in favor of that one that some people are making now for XIII. I don't know if I'd like it or not, but yeah, sometimes design shouldn't be stunted. That's why we got Silent Hill: Shattered Memories, it's why we got Legend of Mana. Some people just can't accept creativity or deviation from standard procedure.
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If it didn't have the Final Fantasy title, I wonder how the reception of this game would have been.
that is a really good point. frankly, after playing it for 20+ hours, i'm quite convinced that a lot of reviewers just didn't "get" this one.
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FF13's director discusses where the FF future is headed. (http://www.shacknews.com/onearticle.x/62793)
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Just to get things out of the way, I am really enjoying the game, and find it to be superb looking -- especially the CGI --, though some of the textures can be inconsistent in terms of quality. The combat system is pretty unique, and definitely has some depth, and is fairly entertaining on the whole. The storytelling has been good as well... and I find it to have that weirdly complex quality that you can expect from some of the better futuristic-fantasy themed manga. The soundtrack is also quite superb, and I have found many of the characters to be endearing.
Having said that, the game is LINEAR AS FUCK. It is literally a narrow point A to point B game. Just to give you an idea... think of the last two Modern Warfare games... now imagine a game more on the rails than those...
Here is the thing. When you define a game's genre, you think of the things that that game does particularly well.
You would never call games like Half-life or Call of Duty RPGs, but you would certainly call those games first person action games, because that is the defining characteristic of those titles.
A game like Call of Duty is linear as hell, but we don't care, because it offers stellar twitch based action, and takes advantage of the linearity to employ some great set pieces.
What is it that FF13 excels at? Is the action good enough to carry the game on its own?
The game I'd like to compare Final Fantasy 13 to is Mass Effect 2.
Mass Effect 1 was a pretty hardcore RPG, with open maps etc.
Mass Effect 2 was a total turnaround. It didn't have an inventory system, it had no stats building, and the character skills were kept to only five. The game was also quite linear. While the 'town' areas were quite open, there was never any action to be found within. You couldn't simply walk from the towns in ME2 to the actiony areas like you would in ME1, and instead had to load those areas through the NPC conversation choices. The actiony areas were on-the-rails map-less areas similar to those in first person shooters like Half-life or Call of Duty.
And while there was some concern voiced over Mass Effect 2's trimming of the RPG fat, the game was overall critically acclaimed despite being a HUGE departure from Mass Effect 1.
Why is that? Why did the critics love Mass Effect 2, yet generally find FF13 to be disappointing?
The difference is that Mass Effect 2 excelled at the third person action elements to the point where it was as good if not better than most action games. It was story driven, yes, but it was a story driven action game, and not quite an RPG. ME2 may have gotten dramatically linear as compared to its predecessor, but it used that linearity to put together some of the most memorable and breathtakingly awesome setpieces I have come across in a game. Had the action in ME2 been terrible, or as average as that of its predecessor, the game would have been panned by the critics, because it didn’t excel as an RPG.
In the end you judge ME2 as an action game, because that's only user controlled aspect where it offers depth. The fact that it does it better than most action games is beside the point.
Final Fantasy 13, is not an action game in the slightest. It is still an RPG, and that's why I can understand why the linearity is disappointing to so many. Its action and storytelling are very very good, but are they good enough to define the game on their own? It depends on the person, really. That's why the scores are so all over the place.
Not every RPG has to be an open world affair like Oblivion, but RPGs need some sense of exploration. Even a game like Diablo was basically all dungeon crawling, but it always had a sense of exploration and what not. Its action was always given much needed breaks with periods interacting with the NPCs in the towns etc.
Final Fantasy games always have had some sense of exploration. They've always had towns, while I haven't encountered any in this yet!
I really do like FF13. I think the action stuff is pretty fun, and the mechanics are fairly deep... and I am a sucker for the storytelling... but I just can't give it a full recommendation.
I remember reading that the developers of the game took inspiration from the linearity of Call of Duty.
I think the developers were pretty stupid. It is like a family car having the fuel consumption of a muscle car, yet not justifying it with that level of power.
The developers of FF13 did talk a lot about using the linearity to employ better storytelling and greater set pieces, but I haven't seen any. In fact, I haven't seen much justification of FF13's course of direction. There is nothing the developers couldn't have done, that they did with FF13, had the same game been more open. There are tons of little scripted cut-scenes that are very good and push the story nicely, but they could have been inter-weaved in a more traditional RPG quite easily.
Anyway, I bet it sounds like I dislike the game, which I don't. I am really pleased with it, because I am enjoying the strengths of it, but I am just saying that I can see why people are disappointed.
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I've put in about 2 hours with it and agree with what you're saying. The pathways are so narrow that it really feels almost on rails. It is still a fun game from what I've played so far though. I'll have more to say about it when I've put in some more time into it.
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While probably a lot shorter than what is in FF 13, Midgar in FF VII was pretty straightforward and linear. You spend the first few hours of the game there and are pretty much directed where to go.
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This is true. It didn't open up until a bit later. I'm not really sure that I've got a problem with the linearity of this one. I don't think "open world" was really that great a strength of series in all cases. Though I did like how FFXII handled things quite a lot.
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From what I saw of previous FF games, they were never open world, but there was some sense of exploration.
I have to say, I am really enjoying FF13. Your party members will often chat with each other as they run, and they do so in a very natural way, and not in the obviously scripted Bioware manner. The only disadvantage is that you can often miss these bits of conversations if you run too far ahead.
There are also a lot of little small cutscenes that break in every fifteen minutes or so, that help weave the story.
The visuals continue to impress. There are some really beautifully imaginative sights in this game.
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something that hasn't really been mentioned here is just how fantastic the soundtrack is. always a strong point in final fantasy games, but i feel that they've really brought it up a notch in this one. it's really quite superb.
also, just to note, the game does open up to exploration and side missions later on.
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Who did the OST for this one?
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Who did the OST for this one?
Masashi Hamauzu. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Masashi_Hamauzu)
EDIT:
More info on FF13's music. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Final_fantasy_13#Music)
Final Fantasy X's co-composer and Dirge of Cerberus's composer Masashi Hamauzu scored the game.[71]
The score features orchestral recordings by the Warsaw Philharmonic Orchestra,[72] (which were orchestrated by Yoshihisa Hirano) though there is also synthetic tracks implemented by Keiji Kawamori.
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I've never played the game, and really haven't read a ton about it. Honestly it wasn't even on my radar until it came out. But I take it most people's complaints about the game is that it doesn't stick with the conventional Final Fantasy formula?
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Well... not really. I don't think it is as simple as that.
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I've heard a lot of varied complaints. For all the linearity and focus on story, I've read a lot of stuff about people calling it kind of soulless and mechanical. Really pretty but no substance, I guess. That seems to me to be fairly subjective as not everyone agrees, but I think that's one of the big ones. Maybe the game just feels a little over-produced?
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IGN's video review:
http://ps3.ign.com/dor/objects/826843/final-fantasy-xiii/videos/ff13_vdr_030810.html
something that hasn't really been mentioned here is just how fantastic the soundtrack is. always a strong point in final fantasy games, but i feel that they've really brought it up a notch in this one. it's really quite superb.
Yea I mentioned that. Agree with everything you say.
I find the game to have plenty of soul myself. Every time I play, it really draws me in. I want to see what happens next, and I like the world and its characters.
Something I find interesting is how it uses flashbacks to create back story, a bit like Lost.
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Got Lightning's Eidolon. First hard fight... got destroyed multiple times and on my successful attempt I only had like 20 left on the counter before I could successfully claim it.
It's an interesting game and is most definitely flawed, and these flaws are big enough to prevent the game from being a truly remarkable experience, but the game is still fun.
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I kept getting beaten on that till I checked for tips on the interwebs.
After that the battle was ridiculously easy. I just took the defensive stance and kept absorbing and won without issue. I am not 100% sure how I was supposed to figure that out... but yea.
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I am not 100% sure how I was supposed to figure that out... but yea.
Use Librascopes or the Libra skill and hit R1 and it will tell you how to defeat the Eidolon pretty easily. That goes for bosses and harder enemies as well.
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Ridiculous. (http://www.gamepro.com/article/news/214447/pay-9-bucks-to-look-at-final-fantasy-xiii-on-your-iphone/)
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Yea I kept casting the Libra, but forgot about pressing R1 afterwards.
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Completed it last night with 42% of the mark missions done. Just so you guys know, it's almost totally impossible to complete some of the later mark missions until you're done with the story.
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Square Enix made another mistake with this game that I've noticed since I started playing but couldn't figure out how to fix it until now. Apparently, Square decided to make Dolby Digital the precedent audio codec to use instead of DTS (if you look at the box, it is clearly stated that DTS and Dolby Digital are both supported). It's a completely illogical decision. Apparently you have to deselect Dolby Digital support within the audio settings of your PS3 (not in game, but on the XMB) in order for DTS to kick in. That is retarded. Most games that support DTS select automatically (Uncharted, Uncharted 2, Heavy Rain, Dragon Age Origins, etc.)
Ranting aside, I'm starting to enjoy this game quite a bit. The story is starting to pick up and events are getting interesting.
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Square Enix made another mistake with this game that I've noticed since I started playing but couldn't figure out how to fix it until now. Apparently, Square decided to make Dolby Digital the precedent audio codec to use instead of DTS (if you look at the box, it is clearly stated that DTS and Dolby Digital are both supported). It's a completely illogical decision. Apparently you have to deselect Dolby Digital support within the audio settings of your PS3 (not in game, but on the XMB) in order for DTS to kick in. That is retarded. Most games that support DTS select automatically (Uncharted, Uncharted 2, Heavy Rain, Dragon Age Origins, etc.)
I have no idea what this means. Do some receivers not support Dolby Digital? Is DTS pretty much the standard?
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He's saying that DTS should be the default when available, so I assume DTS is superior to Dolby Digital. This game doesn't follow that convention, and he's unhappy about it.
Edit: There is no shortage of information anymore. (http://www.practical-home-theater-guide.com/dolby-vs-dts.html)
If the grammar problems there mar credibility, here is an alternative article (http://www.hifi-writer.com/he/dolbydts/dolbydts.htm). It's much shorter too, but basically says the same thing.
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The game is pretty decent, but probably not worth the full price. I've enjoyed what I've played so far, but it has been a pretty monotonous experience.
What has been disappointing is the game's setting. It started with this weird futuristic fantasy thing, but since then has gone into this standard wilderness setting. While the various enemies are very creative looking, the game's maps are starting to look very uninspired.
I was quite excited at first because the game started on this futuristic railway track, with what looked like an advanced city in the background. It reminded of some great animes I've seen. Unfortunately, my party members soon found themselves in the under city, which is devoid of anything that made that opening sequence special.
The combat isn't bad, and I am enjoying it, but it seems all that made the game feel so cohesive and creative at first, is slowly slipping away.
Interestingly enough, the party members have stopped chatting with each other during the exploration portions, which is again disappointing.
But yea, I hope it slips back to what made the game look so interesting, and feel so special.
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25.5 hours in, I've finally left Cocoon and made it to Gran Pulse. It hasn't opened up quite yet because I literally just landed in Pulse and then quit the game. The last 3-4 hours were BORING... basically all of chapter 10. You're stuck in this place that is linear (no surprise there), but also because it doesn't progress the story very much at all. There are like 3 cutscenes that are story related in chapter 10 (the start, the middle and the end) and as a result, it's one big grind. There is a reason to that though and it is woven into the story giving you a reason as to why it's a big grind, but still as the player I'm wondering, 'when is this chapter going to end?'
Anyway, still a good game overall, but chapter 10 sucked.
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Yahtzee's review. Ouch. (http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/zero-punctuation/1569-Final-Fantasy-XIII)
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I'm still playing this right now, I'm about 42 hours in and still enjoying it. Just finished Chapter 11 which was pretty fun, had a nice variety of different areas and all the sidequest stuff was a nice break in the main story and offered some funny cutscenes. The opening to Chapter 12 was fucking awesome, but that's where I stopped last night.
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Yahtzee's review. Ouch. (http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/zero-punctuation/1569-Final-Fantasy-XIII)
Ahahaha! That's one of his funniest outings. I'm glad I wasn't drinking anything when he mentioned banging coconuts together.
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Probably his funniest review since he started, and I actually like the game
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Yahtzee's review. Ouch. (http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/zero-punctuation/1569-Final-Fantasy-XIII)
Hysterical.
One of Yahtzee's best.
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Great review from Yahtzee. What he says is true, though if you do persist through the game it does get a lot better. The first few hours had me scratching my head as I wasn't drawn into the story at all. It does pick up at about the 10 hour mark, and then it gets really boring at about the 20-25 hour mark before the world opens up for you to explore.
This game has its ups and downs, but it's still fun. That said, I've put it on hold right now since I'm working on God of War III.
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Jeff of Giantbomb gives it 3 out 5 stars. (http://www.giantbomb.com/final-fantasy-xiii/61-20664/reviews/)
He starts off rather negative, "I stuck it out because I needed to review the game and because I loved Final Fantasy once, and ultimately I'm glad I did. But if it weren't for those two drivers I'd have probably never made it through the first 15 or so hours it takes to see the good part, where the fighting becomes fun and you start to understand the story and care about what happens to its characters."
But has some good things to say at the end, "There are a lot of great things going on in this game--I genuinely loved something about every aspect, from the combat to the story to the visual design."
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Well, I finally beat the game. What a great story. I clocked in at around 55 hours and still need to do the post game sidequest stuff. Overall, this was a good game, but there are some things they need to address with the next games if they are going to continue in this direction for their next titles. The lack of towns and exploration is probably my biggest complaint and if they could just open up the world a little more (and much earlier) and stick with the same gameplay and story pacing, the next game will be even better.
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I finally finished it tonight... this is the first Final Fantasy game I've ever finished (having only played 7, 8, and this) and I am somewhat disappointed in this game. There were ups and downs at the start, but by the time you hit the 25 hour mark and the game opens up, the story is complete nonsense and I didn't care for the world or the characters. By the time the credits rolled I was grateful it ended, but I still couldn't bring myself to care for any of the characters at all. The gameplay difficulty ramped up significantly in the final chapters, but then the final boss was a complete pushover as well.
Overall, it's a very, very mixed bag. You get to create a cleared game save after the credits so you can return to Pulse and finish up the side missions and max out your characters... I might do a couple more for some trophies since the Gran Pulse missions do pose a nice challenge, but other than that there is no incentive to play the game anymore.
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This is on sale at K-mart the next few days for 30 bucks, if there's one around you. They also have Modern Warfare 2 for 30 bucks, which I picked up.
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Shacknews -> A domain for Final Fantasy XIII-2 has been registered. (http://www.shacknews.com/onearticle.x/67118)
Remember, Square a while back did state that (http://kotaku.com/5446974/interview-there-is-enough-discarded-final-fantasy-xiii-to-make-another-game) there was enough stuff on the cutting room floor to make another game...
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I guess when you're making straight line levels you can really pump them out.
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Zero interest.
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Great, what they initially aborted somehow survived.
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They boxed it and sold it too. Now they're adding more to it.
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Bastards.
Easily my biggest disappointment on the PS3.
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Shacknews -> Final Fantasy XIII-2 officially announced for PS3 and X360 for Winter 2011.
Trailer included in here, as well (in Japanese). (http://www.shacknews.com/onearticle.x/67163)
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Have any of you even played the game? Seems like an awful lot of badmouthing. I didn't play a whole lot but did manage to put a few hours in on Julia's copy. Design choices may have been questionable, but it still seemed like a competent game.
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Played it all the way through and didn't really like it at all, except for the cinematics and the character design.
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Have any of you even played the game? Seems like an awful lot of badmouthing. I didn't play a whole lot but did manage to put a few hours in on Julia's copy. Design choices may have been questionable, but it still seemed like a competent game.
I haven't played the game, but I read a ton of reviews in an attempt to decide whether or not to purchase it. I would place a wager that if the game didn't have the Final Fantasy moniker attached to it, the game would have gotten middling reviews at best. I think Squenix has begun to overestimate their ability to deliver a AAA title and bought into their own bullshit. If it wasn't for the Dragon Quest series, I'd probably be done with them altogether.
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I dunno'. This new game doesn't really appeal to me because JRPGs in general don't anymore, but FFXII is still one of my favorite games of all time.
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I loved what I played of XII. Interesting characters, good writing. Apparently it all takes a huge nose dive in the second half though. At least that's what I've been told.
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Not in my opinion. The story isn't as personal as it should have been, but I think people spent so mich time complaining about what they didn't like with XII that they turned XIII into the antithesis of that and everyone hated it even more. Frankly, I think people are just so hung up on things they do nothing but bitch no matter what gets released. XII had its soundtrack badmouthed almost universally just because Uematsu didn't do it, but it was a bloody Sakimoto masterpiece.
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I enjoy the soundtrack greatly.
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NOTE: There are SPOILERS from FF XIII-1 in below link, so you have been warned...
1Up -> What to expect in FF XIII-2 for story and gameplay. (http://www.1up.com/news/final-fantasy-xiii-2-darker-freer)
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GameSpot -> Final Fantasy XIII-2 - E3 Teaser Trailer. (http://e3.gamespot.com/video/6315324/?tag=topslot%3Bimg%3B1)
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FFXIII-2 Launch Trailer (http://www.gametrailers.com/video/launch-trailer-final-fantasy/724024)
Though it shows that production values are top notch, as is expected from Square, the game, story, characters, and writing look terrible.
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I thought this was pretty notable:
FF XIII-2's Chocobo theme (http://youtu.be/hEUOOgNzOv4)
I'm not sure if this is the best or the worst take on the theme yet (best sure to stick around for at least 11 seconds before you decide).
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I thought this was pretty notable:
FF XIII-2's Chocobo theme (http://youtu.be/hEUOOgNzOv4)
I'm not sure if this is the best or the worst take on the theme yet (best sure to stick around for at least 11 seconds before you decide).
Hahaha, I knew someone was going to post this! Yeah, I was cool with it until the dude starting singing. It's kind of a funny track but I doubt that was their intent. I've listened to a few of the other tracks on the OST and they are pretty good and on the same level as the soundtrack for FFXIII, which isn't surprising since its the same composer.
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A dude starts singing? Where? Not at 11 seconds. :P
Yeouch! That's godawful, and a tragic break from the lovely harmonic nature of past FF music.
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Final Fantasy XIII-2 REVIEWS
GameTrailers -> 8.8 (out of 10). (http://www.gametrailers.com/video/review-hd-final-fantasy/726284)
Eurogamer -> 8. (http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2012-01-27-final-fantasy-13-2-review)
Destructoid -> 8. (http://www.destructoid.com/review-final-fantasy-xiii-2-220373.phtml)
IGN Review -> 8.0 (of 10) = Written review. (http://xbox360.ign.com/articles/121/1217389p1.html); Video Review. (http://www.ign.com/videos/2012/01/27/final-fantasy-xiii-2-video-review)
GameSpot -> 7.5 = Written Review (http://www.gamespot.com/final-fantasy-xiii-2/reviews/final-fantasy-xiii-2-review-6349370/);Video Review. (http://www.gamespot.com/final-fantasy-xiii-2/videos/video-review-final-fantasy-xiii-2-6349382/#toggle_video)
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I'm so weak. I told myself I was going to hold off on buying FFXIII-2 until later, but I ended up picking it up today. I plan on diving into it after I study a little more today.
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I still have to finish XIII! It's such a drag though!!
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IGN -> Square-Enix might do a FF XIII-3. (http://www.ign.com/articles/2012/07/05/is-final-fantasy-xiii-3-on-the-way?utm_campaign=ign+main+twitter&utm_source=twitter&utm_medium=social)
When asked if whether Final Fantasy XIII would be a focus at the the upcoming Final Fantasy 25th Anniversary event, he replied, "The [FFXIII-2] Lightning download content had an ending that left a feeling mystery and hope. The day when the meaning of this will come to light is not too far off."
Speculation about the possibility of a third instalment in Lightning's story has been rife since Final Fantasy XIII-2 ended with the words "to be continued", but this was later suggested to refer to DLC. Now though it seems the original idea could be closer to the mark.
Thankfully we won't have to wait too long to find out; the anniversary event mentioned by Toriyama is scheduled to take place at an art gallery in Shibuya from August 31.
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Level with me...do these games suck? I used to like Final Fantasy games.
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Level with me...do these games suck? I used to like Final Fantasy games.
I love FF games.. I cannot finish FFXIII.. I haven't played FFXIII-2.. Visually FFXIII looks great (though extremely weird), but it is so f'ing boring. To test myself I went back and played FFVIII (the last FF game I found boring) and I'm having a better time with it!
The pipe-dream of every FF fan is a FFVII remake but who knows when/if that will happen. So what we're all holding our collective breath for is FF Versus XIII, which seems to slip away with every Square-Enix announcement or press release (which never mention it).
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Level with me...do these games suck? I used to like Final Fantasy games.
I have made some posts concerning how I felt about the first game in previous posts but hadn't realized I never posted about the second game. FFXIII and XIII-2 do not suck. They both have some shortcomings and problems though, but they have a lot of good things about them as well. Having beat both FFXIII and XIII-2, I can say that I don't have any interest in playing the DLC for XIII-2 or playing any upcoming XIII-3. They really squeezed as much as they could out of that setting and I was really disappointed in how they handled the To Be Continued bullshit ending in XIII-2.
FFXIII and its sequel both have a neat combat system that I enjoyed and excellent visuals. Some of the characters were kind of cool in the first game (I really liked Lightning, Fang, and Sazh), but not so much in the second one. I honestly would have been happy with FFXIII without any kind of sequel because that story got wrapped up rather nicely and I didn't feel like it needed any continuation which is why I had doubts about getting XIII-2 when it first came out. Then I started watching some gameplay videos and hearing impressions about the improvements over the first game and I decided to go through with getting it.
I was enjoying it for the most part and the story was kind of crazy, which is expected of an FF game, but had some interesting elements in it that kept me playing. XIII-2 addressed some of the complaints about the first game, which was mainly that there wasn't enough side content and exploration in FFXIII. XIII-2 added a good amount of side content/exploration and some of the side quests were genuinely interesting in it adding to the main story and universe the game is set in. One of my complaints with XIII-2 is that it had way too many slow moments and a lot of time where stuff wasn't happening which wasn't an issue in the first game. My other complaint with XIII-2 is that Serah and Noel were really not all that interesting characters. I kept wanting to see more of the characters from the previous game and they would show them in little cameos and sections here and there but it wasn't enough. I was really confused why Square took away the focus from the characters of FFXIII and made these two the primary characters of the story.
To you specifically GPW, I don't think you'll enjoy either FFXIII or XIII-2. FFXIII is cheap now since it hit Greatest Hits and it is worth checking out at that price for sure though.
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GamesRadar -> SPOILERS - Story so far w/ FFXIII-1 and FFXIII-2. (http://www.gamesradar.com/final-fantasy-xiii-story-so-far/)
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Apparently, this is coming to PC next month.
Go figure.
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FF13 is already up on Steam for pre-order:
http://store.steampowered.com/app/292120/
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Don't know if you guys been checking forums and stuff, but FF13 PC is up for pre-load on Steam.
It's the talk of the town.
This game is a 60GB download; and now being listed as running at 60FPS on Gamersgate. (http://www.gamersgate.com/DD-FF13/final-fantasy-xiii)
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60GB. Ouch. You know, this next gen with all the game sizes exploding....thats going to be rough. That is a long time on even fast connections not to mention download caps on ISPs.
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If anyone has checked any of the typical forums - i.e. NeoGAF, Steam Forums, Etc...
....FF13 PC is locked at 720p.
Just so y'all know.
EDIT:
Polygon picks up on the story of FF13 PC locked at 720p; and that Durante is working on fixing the game. (http://www.polygon.com/2014/10/9/6953127/final-fantasy-13-pc-steam-release)
EDIT 2:
Durante's Page -> GeDoSaTo gets Pre-Alpha plug-in for FFXIII PC Released from Durante. (http://blog.metaclassofnil.com/?p=618)
EDIT 3 -> :
This is embarrassing; we're now seeing comparison vids from major internet gaming publications...
Polygon -> FFXIII PC - Comparison vids of 720p original (unmodded) vs 1080p w/ Durante's Mod GeDoSaTo (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0bJX_tPpEBA)
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PC gamers are the absolute worst. I get it, there aren't a ton of options there and it only really runs in one resolution. Yeah, that's really shitty for a big budget release. But it's a $15 game that was announced about three weeks ago. I find this to be a completely different situation compared to something like Dark Souls being released for full price. PC gamers just bitch to bitch about stuff. It's like complaining that Fez runs in 720p. "But Square Enix has the money to properly port it!" Yeah, but they don't care. It's $15. Anyone already playing it probably got it for $10. It's completely functional, get over it.
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Totally, it's like when they bitched about Halo going to console and now they can never get over the scorn thus hating forever an actual good game. AMIRITE
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I get it, there aren't a ton of options there and it only really runs in one resolution. Yeah, that's really shitty for a big budget release.
Exactly.
But it's a $15 game that was announced about three weeks ago.
Doesn't matter if it's $15 or when it was announced. It should've been done properly.
This is a AAA title from a AAA company. They could've priced it up a bit and released it in a more reasonable 1080p setting - which has been the PC gaming standard resolution for years, BTW.
PC gamers normally sit ultra-close on their PC's, while console gamers often sit much further back on a couch - so, b/c of our field of view + 1080p makes much more sense here than on the consoles.
Plus, we have hardware that can handle it, as well.
And other PC titles from Square have been in 1080p and above - which makes this even odder.
Plus, most titles on the PC these days have numerous different resolutions supported or have arbtitrary-res' support, anyways.
I find this to be a completely different situation compared to something like Dark Souls being released for full price. PC gamers just bitch to bitch about stuff. It's like complaining that Fez runs in 720p. "But Square Enix has the money to properly port it!" Yeah, but they don't care. It's $15. Anyone already playing it probably got it for $10. It's completely functional, get over it.
While I do not have the game - gamers have reported framerate raises + drops, no matter the system...before the mod and after it.
So, it still ain't perfect even in 720p - especially when compared to other PC ports that can do higher resolutions.
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Totally, it's like when they bitched about Halo going to console and now they can never get over the scorn thus hating forever an actual good game. AMIRITE
The original Halo wasn't that good - sorry.
While the first half was great, second half wasn't.
2nd half had lots of reused/recycled areas (monitor levels, anyone?), copy + paste areas, and backtracking - just like Dragon Age 2.
Can't speak on Halo 2 and newer, though. Still would like to see the rest of the series ported here, as well.
Same goes for Fable 2 + Gear of Wars series, as well.
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I love you D.
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PC gamers are the absolute worst. I get it, there aren't a ton of options there and it only really runs in one resolution. Yeah, that's really shitty for a big budget release. But it's a $15 game that was announced about three weeks ago. I find this to be a completely different situation compared to something like Dark Souls being released for full price. PC gamers just bitch to bitch about stuff. It's like complaining that Fez runs in 720p. "But Square Enix has the money to properly port it!" Yeah, but they don't care. It's $15. Anyone already playing it probably got it for $10. It's completely functional, get over it.
They're no worse than the console fanboys. They constantly bicker about resolution, and most recently accusing Ubisoft of holding back AC Unity on the PS4 for parity with the XB1. They don't want to hear that the game is CPU-bound, by thousands of NPCs at any given time, and both frame rate and resolution take a hit as a result, on both consoles. Oh no, it must be a shady deal with the devil himself: Microsoft. For every discussion about actual gaming, there are 10 about this kind of horseshit. So, what do you think, #GetOverIt? Or is that taken already.
D, get over it.
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Dorkly: The PC vs. Console Gaming Argument, Basically (http://www.dorkly.com/post/57406/the-pc-vs-console-argument-basically)
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Haha! It's all just as silly anyway. And there's that word again--horseshit. :)
At this point, I think developers/publishers should stop talking about the subject entirely--put out the stats (e.g., 900p @30fps) once if they want to disclose them at all, and not ever try to justify them in any way. Buy the game or don't; that's your only choice. Bitch all you want; won't change a thing. Fannies are going to bitch no matter what the devs say, so why give them any more fuel for the fire?
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Haha! It's all just as silly anyway. And there's that word again--horseshit. :)
At this point, I think developers/publishers should stop talking about the subject entirely--put out the stats (e.g., 900p @30fps) once if they want to disclose them at all, and not ever try to justify them in any way. Buy the game or don't; that's your only choice. Bitch all you want; won't change a thing. Fannies are going to bitch no matter what the devs say, so why give them any more fuel for the fire?
How about #horseshit - to be used whenever someone, somewhere gets their panties in a bunch over something completely retarded and video-game related. You have a good point there though - throw the product out there and refuse to comment on the technical details like that. As much of a dick Steve Jobs could be, his philosophy on dealing with customers is pretty hilarious "Hold your phone differently" and kind of respectable in a weird way.
Exactly.
Doesn't matter if it's $15 or when it was announced. It should've been done properly.
This is a AAA title from a AAA company. They could've priced it up a bit and released it in a more reasonable 1080p setting - which has been the PC gaming standard resolution for years, BTW.
PC gamers normally sit ultra-close on their PC's, while console gamers often sit much further back on a couch - so, b/c of our field of view + 1080p makes much more sense here than on the consoles.
Plus, we have hardware that can handle it, as well.
And other PC titles from Square have been in 1080p and above - which makes this even odder.
Plus, most titles on the PC these days have numerous different resolutions supported or have arbtitrary-res' support, anyways.
While I do not have the game - gamers have reported framerate raises + drops, no matter the system...before the mod and after it.
So, it still ain't perfect even in 720p - especially when compared to other PC ports that can do higher resolutions.
See, this is what I don't get. People throw around the word "entitled" a lot when talking about gamers and it's usually bullshit. Although, sometimes it's not. This is one of those times. Who's to say what "properly" is for a game at a fifteen dollar price point? To me, properly means it's playable and it's exactly that. Would improved resolution support be good? Yes, it'd be great. Is it game breaking? not even close.
And really, lets not fuck around here, it's a port of a game that was an AA title 5 years ago which was released on PC at a price point roughly 1/5th of the original release price. Hell, new copies of the PS3 Greatest hits version currently still sell for more than the PC version. Yes, the PC is a budget game in every meaning of the word.
There is nothing odd about Square's lack of 1080p. Obviously they're technically capable of doing it, they just probably didn't think that spending the additional development time in order to offer additional options was worth the time and resources on the PC version....it's a 5 year old budget game. That said, this has done a lot better than I'm sure they originally though, so maybe they'll offer support in a patch, maybe not. Who knows? In either case, it's not nearly the end of the world that people are making it out to be. The games not in VGA - if someone claims they can't enjoy something because it's in 720p that's purely their fucking problem.
I've run this game for 3 hours or so. I don't know if I like it or not really, but I do know that it runs completely fine on my old PC. Are some people having frame drops? Sure, probably, but this is PC gaming - SOME PEOPLE are going to have some problems with almost any game out there. I don't believe it's anything wide spread at all. What I have read is people complaining about 30fps in cut-scenes - again, if that ruins something for you it's your deal. That also leads me to believe that some of these people complaining about frame drops are complaining about dropping from 60 to 45fps or something like that - close fraps, walk away.
The only other complaint I've heard is that the ESC key closes the game right down. Is it weird? Yes. Is it a bug? Possibly. Game breaking? DON'T PRESS THE FUCKING ESCAPE KEY UNLESS YOU WANT TO EXIT OUT.
It's not a great port but it works. Hell, it works better than a lot of PC games on release. It could be done better for sure, but raising a shitstorm over 720p and the escape key? #horseshit
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@GPW
One of the strangest things is this: The Last Remnant PC version can run in 1080p by default, which hit the PC in 2009.
Yes, 2009. Before FFXIII dropped on consoles. And Square Enix was the one who supposedly did that TLR PC port!
You mean to tell me Square Enix couldn't take the time to even implement the 1080p res, when TLR PC did? That's what's so baffling here.
I'm not asking for the moon here w/ a PC port, I don't think - asking for 1080p res'.
While I'd rather Square support graphics bells + whistle out the gate officially in-game - if they won't, I can just use my NVidia panel here to force AA, AF, and other graphics bells + whistles on, if necessary...as long as it'll work w/ the game (hopefully).
And when I do get FFXIII PC - you can bet that if Square don't do anything to improve FFXIII PC, I'm going to use Durante's GeDoSaTo.
Also, about dips + rises in framerates, usually 10 frames or more - when that's happening when gameplay is happening, it's noticeable. When it happens during gameplay, that can cause stutters slow-downs or speed-ups in gameplay - all which can make play less fluid and much less natural. If it's happening b/t switches from say end of gameplay to cut-scene or vice versa - I don't think the framerate dips like that will be big problem.
Also, there's been claims for people locking it to 30 frames - and it still will drop 10-15 frames, when it does. If that happens during gameplay, that's unacceptable to dip below 20 frames. Better off sticking w/ lock to 60 frames and tolerate the drop to 45 or so - which is a bit more tolerable. The lock 30 FPS solution is a fine solution, IMHO - as long as the framerate doesn't stray too far from there during gameplay.
I have TLR PC locked to 30 frames - and it looks and runs fine, without problems or anything of the sort. I could've kept it at 60 FPS - but for me, even w/ Turbo Mode off, I can't hit the buttons w/ the right timing, when you get a Quick-Time Prompt during combat. I have no problem w/ locking games down to 30 frames, if they're going to stay around that framerate - and to keep some games stable (i.e. NFS: The Run, Dark Souls PTD, NFS: Rival, NFS: Hot Pursuit) - that's exactly what I did. To keep Thief 2014 stable - I used EVGA Precision X and locked that one down to 40 FPS, since its constant fluctuations b/t 40-60 frames were driving me nuts.
EDIT:
I think Bully PC is the worst PC port I've ever seen in all my years of PC gaming, BTW.
Yes, even worse than Dark Souls PTD (unmodded). At least Dark Souls PTD was function, locked it its low-res. It just...needed some PC love to make it look better - all thanks to Durante.
And there's my next thought - Dark Souls PTD PC is a down-right beautiful game. And from the screens I've seen w/ FFXIII PC - the same can be said for that, too. These games have such beautiful and fantastic art direction, that I don't want to see the res' limited. I don't want these games held back. They deserve to have their beauty and art direction shown, off in the current PC standard of 1080p glory. I want these games to be done justice on the PC.
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Dorkly: The PC vs. Console Gaming Argument, Basically (http://www.dorkly.com/post/57406/the-pc-vs-console-argument-basically)
For some reason I became fixated on their tiny hands.
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@GPW
One of the strangest things is this: The Last Remnant PC version can run in 1080p by default, which hit the PC in 2009.
Yes, 2009. Before FFXIII dropped on consoles. And Square Enix was the one who supposedly did that TLR PC port!
You mean to tell me Square Enix couldn't take the time to even implement the 1080p res, when TLR PC did? That's what's so baffling here.
I'm not asking for the moon here w/ a PC port, I don't think - asking for 1080p res'.
While I'd rather Square support graphics bells + whistle out the gate officially in-game - if they won't, I can just use my NVidia panel here to force AA, AF, and other graphics bells + whistles on, if necessary...as long as it'll work w/ the game (hopefully).
And when I do get FFXIII PC - you can bet that if Square don't do anything to improve FFXIII PC, I'm going to use Durante's GeDoSaTo.
Who knows why they didn't include 1080p support. They didn't and people can either live with it or just not by the game. My point is that the circle jerk around it is ridiculous.
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Who knows why they didn't include 1080p support. They didn't and people can either live with it or just not by the game. My point is that the circle jerk around it is ridiculous.
My guess: to try and save money.
And possibly, they might even hoped someone like Durante would do exactly like he did w/ Dark Souls PC, Deadly Premonition, and other games - mod them up.
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It's likely a cost-cutting measure, they didn't want to redo the UI from scratch for 1080p.
I bet someone will figure out how to force the game to 1080p and we'll see the UI looking aliased and stretched.
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It's likely a cost-cutting measure, they didn't want to redo the UI from scratch for 1080p.
I bet someone will figure out how to force the game to 1080p and we'll see the UI looking aliased and stretched.
That's what Durante's GeDoSaTo program/mod (http://blog.metaclassofnil.com/?page_id=582) is for - to take games stuck in a certain (low) res, up-sample them to very high res', then down-sample them.
Plus, you can add more graphics bells + whistles, too.
If you check the GAF, modders already working on new fonts that ain't jagged.
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So, I'm one of the clowns who bought this, because at $10 who gives a shit.
Honestly, I don't get a lot of the flak this game gets. If I wanted to play an RPG, this would probably be it - and I put like 10 hours into it. I get that a lot of people were let down with the linear nature, but that's kind of Final Fantasy and what you should expect. Sure, usually they open up a bit (or at least used to?), but it was always a fake kind of open - "You can go anywhere now!! But really, you need to go here, here, and then here, in this order. And all those other places have nothing to do right now or you've already done everything". FFXII was somewhat different but it was the odd man out. It was good, but it was also a departure and I'm sure some were let down.
So, what you get here is a very (extremely) linear adventure with a shit ton of polish, great music, and maybe the best RPG battle system I've seen. It has an in-media-res opening and never stops to explain what the fuck is going on, but five minutes of reading the data logs in-game and I was caught up.
I found the music, polish, and battle system enough to keep me playing when I didn't even want to - which says a lot. In the end there are JRPG tropes that I just can't get past but if I wanted to play a JRPG, this would probably be the one.
But I don't.
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Polygon -> Information on PC versions of both FFXIII-1 and FFXIII-2. (http://www.polygon.com/2014/11/11/7195223/final-fantasy-13-pc-port-graphics-options-update)
-> FFXIII PC patch officially coming to put in custom resolution support (720p, 1080p, etc) & other graphics settings in December.
-> FFXIII-2 PC is also coming on December 11th w/ all of those features planned in FFXIII PC patch; 60 frames per sec gameplay support; and Japanese voice-overs + subtitles support.
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Final Fantasy XIII (PC) -> My 1st Impressions
I've got about 8 1/2 hours into the PC version of Final Fantasy XIII. Here's some thoughts.
This game's beautiful, artistically. I just love to see every frame + every detail in this game, in its glory on my PC. This is one of the most beautiful games that I've ever seen - period. Even with FFXIII PC stuck at 720p currently - it's still beautiful. It just currently doesn't live up to its possible potential on the PC, until Square's upcoming patch comes that'll fix the lack of higher-resolutions and add some graphical features; or gamers actually decide to use the fantastic program GeDoSaTo. In the meantime, until we see what the official patch brings us - GeDoSaTo does a fantastic job of making this game look extremely beautiful and actually live up to its potential. If you're looking to to push the game to 1080p or above - GeDoSaTo is currently a must to have, just to do so. And it looks simply amazing in 1080p.
Performance on my PC (i7 950; 16 GB of RAM; 1 GB VRAM GeForce GTX 560 Ti; Win 7 64-bit) was all over the place w/ GeDoSaTo - when downsampling to 1080p and some graphical features turned on or at some higher setting. Depending on whether you're in battle or just roaming the game-world, the game fluctuates its maximum cap either at 30 frames per second or 60 frames. Turning some GeDoSaTo's settings off or to lower settings helped a lot - but wasn't enough. When above 30 frames (when the game goes capped at 60), the issue was trying to get something solid. It would be a bit all over the place, b/t 35 frames to 60. But, still - it took locking the game's VSync to half-rate (30 frames) at all times via NVidia Panel to end all of my issues with bouncing frame-rates and to give me something slick and as smooth as silk.
Gameplay is quite different, compared to older FF games. Granted, I haven't played a FF game since FF9 on the original PlayStation. FF13 is not entirely turn-based, either - even though you have menus with skills, attacks, items, and whatnot to pick from. Combat is faster-paced, as you have a timed-meter and you can queue-up moves to use before the bar is full. Once it's full, whatever you queued-up will happen or you can attack right there on the fly. Whatever move you use, it uses up a certain amount of the bar. Some attacks take up more of the bar, some (like a regular attack) take up much less. You do NOT control the entire party directly, either. Anyone else in the party - they're NPC's, controlled by the game and its AI. You only can control entirely the character designated at the leader for the game's chapter, section, or whatever the case is. The better you do in combat, the more spoils and/or the better the spoils you get from battle will get.
Early on, this seems like a very easy system to learn - which it is, as a good deal of the first few hours of the game is teaching you a lot of the game's systems and mechanics. It teaches them to you in a pace that's slowly, but surely. It might even take a bit too long, for some players to get. Then, things later get more complex and way more interesting - once more characters, Classes and Paradigms are introduced. Once these are introduced - for any other party members: you basically tell them their specific role to play. Once this stuff gets unlocked, when your character has more Classes behind them and more Paradigms to switch between, the game can get more difficult + constantly keep you on your toes. When leveling-up happens and certain events happen, you can then push what directions you want the character to go in. The further you go along - the more Classes and their skills, abilities, and whatnot are available for you to decide to level-up with. Most characters have more than one Class - and you'll need to switch between those classes on the fly when facing certain enemies or at the right time to succeed in combat. Once the game introduces the Paradigm system around some 3-4 hours into the game - more Classes, and more skills are available to the player, turning the game's combat into this fast-paced; quick-thinking needed; strategic; and extremely fun + addictive combat system.
There's a lot of story; characters; events; and FFXIII-created jargon + terms here going on. If you don't have a clue what's going on with the stories, characters, terms, and anything they're talking about - make sure you read the DataLog, once the game tells you it got updated. The Log explains pretty much anything & everything that you likely have no clue about and/or have questions about - as often the game feels like it's just putting you in the midst of something with little to no much explanation; or there's something you just want more information on. DataLog pretty much expands on this, cluing the player in on just about everything the player needs to know. Just like reading a Codex feels necessary in a Mass Effect game, the same can definitely be said about the DataLog here in FFXIII.
The game itself constantly is switching b/t stories, characters, who's the lead in this chapter that you're controlling, and whatnot. The game's story is nothing short of epic in scope. With such a cast of characters, one can't help but feel attached to most of them, as the game is constantly dishing out story, cut-scenes, and events to make you really care about these characters. Sure, some of the game's story is absolutely ridiculous, over-the-top, and melodramatic - but, we expect that from Final Fantasy. Above all, there's so much humor, charm + personality to this game and its characters, one still can't help but still be swept off their feet by the magic.
One thing that might seem jarring is even after 8 1/2 hours of this game, especially from fans of the FF series: your access to the game-world is extremely linear. We're talking Call of Duty linear here, as the game goes in order pretty much from chapter-to-chapter, in one direction without little to no side-directions, side-quests, or anything of the sort. The game-world, at least so far, is not open at all to explore. Everything here happens from chapter-to-chapter, playing out in a mostly linear A-to-B funneled straight and tunneled right down a corridor type of fashion. Since the game's so linear and feels like you move in one corridor or maze from Point A to B - don't expect to run into towns, either. In some ways, the game so far feels like a big dungeon crawl - as after my approximate 8 1/2 hours with this, I haven't ran into any towns. This JRPG feels like it also took FF into the dungeon-crawl realm, but with checkpoint saves thrown in-between. At these save points, you can also access the game's shops - where you can buy + sell any equipment that you have.
It's hard to say if this linearity here is for better or for worse b/c its huge emphasis on story + character is one of the best that I've seen in the series (keep in mind, I've only played FF1 on t he NES; and FF5,6,7,8 and 9 on the PSX). It'd definitely different in a FF game, that's for sure. Whether this linearity is for better or worse - that's of course, as long as immediacy of the story + character development doesn't fall apart anytime down the road. Let's hope for the best - b/c after 8 1/2 hours, I'm having a hard time putting down FFXIII especially b/c of its story + characters; and finally with the combat system turning its tide some 3-4 hours into the game.
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I really liked your writeup and agree for the most part. Fuck, I even reinstalled the game. As much as I dislike the anime nature that goes hand in hand with the FF series (and I used to be a pretty big FF fan) I just love the music and visuals in this game, as well as the combat.
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PC Gamer -> FF XIII PC resolution + graphical options update will come on Dec. 11, 2014...
...the same day they'll release FFXIII-2 PC on Steam. (http://www.pcgamer.com/square-enix-dates-final-fantasy-xiii-resolution-update/)
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PC Gamer -> Lightning Returns: Final Fantasy XIII [AKA Final Fantasy XIII-3] is coming to Windows PC "around December". (http://www.pcgamer.com/lightning-returns-final-fantasy-xiii-is-coming-around-december/)
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So, I'm kind of trying to play this on PC again and I think maybe I just don't get something about the upgrades or battle system. Like, it was pretty fun and then all of a sudden I'm dealing with these two characters party and it seems like it takes forever to make a larger enemy stagger. As a result, I'm in like 5 minute battles of just "auto, auto, auto, auto, switch abilities, auto, auto, switch abilities, auto, auto, auto, auto..... I'm pretty positive I'm using the right classes at the right times, but it just seems to take forever.
It could be related to the upgrade/equipment system. It confuses me a bit. I see that there are other weapons out there for the characters, but if I were to switch at this point I'd have to go down to level one and use a bunch more resources to upgrade back to level XXXX. It seems like there's a bit of a sunk cost thing going on here (and not a false one) where it would just be wiser to stick with whatever weapon you started with and upgrade it until you can't anymore and then spend resources after that on the best available until it outshines it. That can't possibly be a mechanic though, so I'm missing something.
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Eurogamer - Entire FF13 Trilogy is going to be Backwards Compatible on XBox One:
https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2018-11-09-final-fantasy-13-trilogy-to-be-xbox-one-backwards-compatible
So, the entire FF13 Trilogy is, as follows:
FF13 (original)
FF13-2
Lightning Returns: FF13 (A.K.A. FF13-3).