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Games => General Gaming => Topic started by: gpw11 on Monday, October 27, 2014, 07:39:04 PM

Title: Metal Gear Solid Thread - and the trick to playing MGS2
Post by: gpw11 on Monday, October 27, 2014, 07:39:04 PM

After playing MGS4 I bought the HD Collection on PSN for PS3, followed up by the HD Collection on Vita just recently.  The games are Cross Play (Cross Save) but unfortunately NOT Cross Buy (So, I ended up paying $15 for the Collection on PS3 and I think $10 for the Collection on Vita), but for $25 I have no complaints. Especially since it's awesome to play on the console and then pick up and play on the road - and the Vita touch controls are actually great for inventory management in these games.

I'm just playing through MGS2 for the first time since it first came out on PC over ten years ago and looking forward to Snake Eater (never played it), but I find Kojima's story telling so strange.  In every game I've played he has all these bad ass characters and convoluted (but deep..but also convoluted enough that it deserves mention twice) plot lines but inserts these terribly terrible characters.  And every time it seems like he claims he inserts them in so that there is someone the player can relate to - I'm talking about Otocon in the first MGS and Raiden in this one (Sunny/Sonny in the latest game).  Now, Raiden isn't THAT bad, but Otocon is just the worst character to watch in every game he's been in.  It's brutal.

I've found the trick to not hating MGS2 is just skipping that shit.  Literally every time Rose and Raiden start talking, I skip the convo.  Every time Otocon starts talking to Emma I just walk out of the room

(click to show/hide)

Emma is currently dying in the other room...don't care

.  It's really made this more enjoyable for me.

Title: Re: Metal Gear Solid Thread - and the trick to playing MGS2
Post by: gpw11 on Monday, October 27, 2014, 09:54:35 PM

And just finished MGS2.  It makes me not want to play - I forgot how much bullshit you have to deal with at the end.  I've never played MGS3 and can only hope there's far less abstract nonsense going on.

Title: Re:
Post by: scottws on Tuesday, October 28, 2014, 04:56:57 AM

MGS2 stinks no matter how you slice it.

Title: Re: Metal Gear Solid Thread - and the trick to playing MGS2
Post by: Xessive on Tuesday, October 28, 2014, 07:36:25 AM

I might argue that MGS3 was more abstract than any of the previous MGS games. It poses various philosophical quandaries.

MGS4 was my favourite since it was far more accessible and gave me a lot of variety in terms of gameplay styles.

Title: Re: Metal Gear Solid Thread - and the trick to playing MGS2
Post by: K-man on Tuesday, October 28, 2014, 08:17:15 AM

MGS2 was much better the second time I played it.  By then I had accepted the bait and switch.

plus,

I need to play 4 again.  I was in such a rush the first time to finish the story that I didn't really take the time to enjoy it.

Title: Re: Metal Gear Solid Thread - and the trick to playing MGS2
Post by: PyroMenace on Thursday, October 30, 2014, 07:02:50 AM

I need to play these again. MGS1 - 4 were fucking incredible.

And yes, they are so anime.

Title: Re: Metal Gear Solid Thread - and the trick to playing MGS2
Post by: gpw11 on Monday, November 03, 2014, 07:57:14 PM

Just finished playing through MGS 3 and it's probably my favorite so far.  The order I played was Roughly MGS 1 (like 15 years ago) > MGS 2 (like ten years ago) >MGS4 (this year)>Replay of MGS 2 > MGS3

I think MGS 4 definitely has the most refined gameplay, although the stealth action in MGS 3 is arguably better (although very different, as someone on IRC pointed out - just a hell of a lot of belly crawling). I think the jungle enviroment sections just really shined here.  I would take the tightness of controls in MGS4 any day though.

I think why I liked this one the most was it was just a great plot of political intrigue without all the whacked anime shit that I find really takes away from it in the other games - plus it was really cool to see some of the characters I had been introduced to in MGS 4 but knew nothing about.

I don't know if I'll ever play Phantom Pain or the other part of MGS V, but we'll see - I certainly seem to like the prequels more than the sequels, although I have a feeling that's just the way Kojima tackled MGS 3 and have no idea if that will transfer over to the others.

All in all, these games are something I kind of love, kind of dislike.  Every aspect is pretty awesome, but never quite as good as I'd like it to be.  I love plots full of political intrigue, but there's so much anime abstract stuff in there as well that it turns me off.  I find the steath gameplay to be less enjoyable than, say, Splinter Cell or Hitman, and I find the gunplay just terrible.   The design of the games is just brilliant though, and that really comes through in the boss fights and certain segments of each game.

I'm onto Revengence, although I do know that's a completely different ballgame.

Title: Re: Metal Gear Solid Thread - and the trick to playing MGS2
Post by: gpw11 on Sunday, November 09, 2014, 04:02:08 AM

Metal Gear Rising: Revengence -- Played maybe 2 hours and am done with it.  I WANT to like it, despite it being corny as hell and not a MGS game at all, but I just can't.  The main culprit here being the camera.

They've tried pretty hard to make a more refined Ninja Gaiden and it just didn't work.  You have two attack buttons, and one of them doubles as the parry button. So, you're the middle of fighting multiple enemies and one's about to attack, you press the attack/parry button and press the thumb stick in the direction of the attacker to parry, or, if your timing is right, counterattack. I can't decide if this is dumb or brilliant.  On one hand, having a context sensitive button like that is just retarded because half the time you're in the middle of pressing it anyways (to attack) when you realize you need to get on the defensive, so your timing is completely off.  On the other hand, it's kind of brilliant because it prevents you from mashing the attack button, so you have to play a more defensive game.  The comparison to Ninja Gaiden comes from this - I remember the Xbox game being very tough and required you to block and counterattack to win, and that's what I think they're going for here, it's just that NG did it much much better years ago.  This could potentially work out great and I think if I stuck with it more it would be awesome, because the combat has glimpses of being really fun and I like the idea behind the parry system...but I just can't stand it because of something else going on.

The camera.  The camera is shit. Terrible. You're a robot ninja, you're fighting ten dudes, and you're jumping around everywhere.  The auto-lock targets whatever enemy is closest and in front.  The fucking camera generally tries to face whatever the character is facing, which is a shit concept at all when you're a ninja jumping around trying to fight ten dudes, and even more terrible when it just doesn't work. What's worse is that it seems to override the manual camera controls when shifting.  So you find the camera heading away from the action, you can't bring it back until it's done focusing on the brick wall you don't want to be looking at - meanwhile, you're getting murdered. The real problem here is that the parry move I mentioned is camera relative....and the camera is character relative. So you can be moving in to attack, see that you're about to be attacked, push the thumb stick towards the attacker, and then have the camera spaz out so the direction you're pushing in no longer equates to the incoming attack. OR you finish a combo and no longer have the enemy on screen so you miss the tell that they're about to attack. Obviously, in both scenarios you get the shit kicked out of you. 

It's kind of frustrating because it could be really fun, and I'm sure if you spent time and worked at it you could get good, work around it, and really get into the flow.  It's so close, but just misses it.  With Ninja Gaiden or Devil May Cry I never felt like I was taking hits all the time because the game was flawed, just that I wasn't fast enough or I over extended myself.   Here it's another story.  I'm sure I COULD get used to it, but why bother? There are too many good games out there to feel like I have to work with a flawed system.  Especially when the core of the game is dealing with a terrible character in some super robot ninja war and all of a sudden he has a robot dog sidekick and horribly executed stealth elements shoved in to the package. Oh, and all the worst parts of every Metal Gear game all at once - dancing overpowered robots, whiny characters, dumb jokes, and GOD DAMN IT, WHY IS IT SO BAD?

tl;dr:  MGR:Revengence - Terrible camera cheapens combat, strips the good parts out of MGS games, jacks up the bad parts, and is anime as fuck.  I'M OUT!