Author Topic: So I'm going vegan.  (Read 42673 times)

Offline Pugnate

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #40 on: Sunday, April 21, 2013, 03:22:52 AM »
So why go vegan and not vegetarian?

Offline Quemaqua

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #41 on: Sunday, April 21, 2013, 06:54:37 AM »
Because the inhumanity does exist, and because even if you have absolutely no moral qualms about eating animals, the health standards of factory farming are something you can't logically be aware of and continue to take part in. That includes eggs and milk. I haven't always made the best health decisions, but I've always striven to do better. And not for any sort of moral reason. I just want to be healthier. People don't seem to understand how well you can eat on a vegan diet. Vegan food is not inherently healthy, it's just inherently animal-free. There are tons of vegan cookbooks filled to the brim with cakes, cookies, rich sauces, what have you, and if you've ever been to a really good vegan restaurant that isn't strictly focused on healthy stuff, you know there are tons of wonderfully delicious things that have no animal products and are still not what you would call a healthy choice.

[EDIT - Er, and I sort of stopped here mid-thought. My point was that it doesn't have to strictly be about morality or health, nor about this great call to abandon pleasure (which is how almost everyone views it, and that's totally wrong). But for me personally it definitely is about health, and I like to make healthy food. Plus by giving up animal products, which are among the most expensive food items we buy, I can afford higher quality organic items across the board and still eat pretty cheaply. And since the food I'm buying is healthier (even if you're talking about lower quality produce, heavily covered in pesticides, it's considered to be healthier than meats and a lot of other animal products, since the animals absorb many of the same toxins through their own food, plus others, and they're absorbing it through ingestion, thus saturated with it), I can eat some richer, fattier, more delicious food on occasion—the equivalent of an occasional big steak dinner or mound of dessert—and feel at the very least that I'm negating some of that extra damage. Aside from the fact that a lot of those things will still be far healthier in the end, even if they aren't health food, than their animal byproduct counterparts.]

For me, I find it easiest to just acknowledge the baseline ideology. The root concept is to respect life, to not take from an animal what is theirs any more than we would steal from another person: neither steal their life nor the things they create for themselves. It's an imaginary line, just like everything else, but certainly not an arbitrary one.
« Last Edit: Sunday, April 21, 2013, 07:26:39 AM by Quemaqua »

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Offline Pugnate

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #42 on: Sunday, April 21, 2013, 07:13:52 AM »
I think you should write a blog on how you, a lifetime meat eater, have gone vegan.

Offline Quemaqua

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #43 on: Sunday, April 21, 2013, 07:24:46 AM »
I would be blogging about it if my website wasn't still broken. I haven't had time to fix the damned thing. I'm really sick and tired of reinstalling Wordpress.

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Offline Xessive

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #44 on: Sunday, April 21, 2013, 09:10:48 AM »
Switch to something else, like Weebly or something.

I'd love to read your experiences and thoughts on the subject and also to share them with others.

Offline Quemaqua

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #45 on: Sunday, April 21, 2013, 10:54:58 AM »
It's a time issue... I already built everything with WP and figured out how to use that, at this point I just don't have the time to start over. I might at some point, though, when I have time. Either way I hope to get it back up soon and I'll likely dedicate the occasional post to updates on how it's going, what I'm doing, what I've learned, interesting surprises or bizarre food experiences. Should be good times.

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Offline ren

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #46 on: Sunday, April 21, 2013, 12:28:51 PM »
Yea I think it is more vegetarian than vegan. I think going Vegan is way harder, considering that you have to let go of dairy. Milk and eggs are a tough thing to lose.

Don't forget the "pure veg" options in India which are vegetarian but also no eggs. Then all you need to do is have a milk substitute and it's vegan.

I'm lactose-intolerant so all my vegetarian Indian food ends up being Vegan so maybe I just think it's more prevalent than it is.

I'll have to see what I can replace eggs with in my molasses cookies. Unless my eggs are ok, since our chickens are free range most days and the cage is quite spacious when they go in. So..I dunno, guess thats up to you to decide.

I haven't found good Vegan cookies but there are some delicious vegan cakes around.

Offline Quemaqua

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #47 on: Sunday, April 21, 2013, 06:46:15 PM »
Dude, there are good vegan cookies. The Alternative Baking Company sells packaged stuff that you would never be able to distinguish from a "regular" cookie. I think they're based in San Francisco, but there are a bunch of other companies that make similar packaged stuff for supermarkets and health food stores. You like the Veganomicon... check out Isa's prior book, Vegan with a Vengeance, which has more guilty pleasures, as I understand it, and another she did with her co-author, Vegan Cupcakes Take Over the World. I've heard great things about both. I actually got a copy of the Veganomicon the other day. Been checking it out... looks like some awesome stuff.

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Offline idolminds

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #48 on: Wednesday, April 24, 2013, 01:28:59 PM »
I found a recipe for vegan molasses cookies that I'll have to experiment with sometime.

Tonight I ended up making a vegan dish, chickpea curry. I saw some recipes online and got the general idea and just went and threw something together. Big can of chickpeas, some diced tomatoes with garlic and onions (we never use these normally since dad doesn't like garlic), I chopped up a yellow bell pepper, added a few scoops of our hot pepper blend we made after our garden went crazy last year, some vegetable broth, and then spiced it with some curry powder, turmeric, cumin, and a little cloves. Plan on serving it on some rice, I'll let you know how it all turns out.

Offline Quemaqua

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #49 on: Wednesday, April 24, 2013, 04:39:35 PM »
Sounds awesome! I've found that vegan food has invigorated my love of cooking, I guess mostly because it's... new. Not boring. There are so many interesting combinations of things to try that don't rely on the old standards, and it makes cooking a lot of fun for me. I'm really enjoying the time I spend in the kitchen, despite my shitty kitchen.

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Offline idolminds

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #50 on: Wednesday, April 24, 2013, 05:53:05 PM »
Note: it was delicious. I recommend it. Getting excited about cooking counts for a lot. For me its not just trying a new recipe, but also sort of winging it. "What do I have? Ok...lets see, some of this, some of that, chop one of these...DINNER!" So far I haven't made anything bad.

Offline Quemaqua

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #51 on: Wednesday, April 24, 2013, 06:21:57 PM »
Oh totally. My mom basically taught me to never use a recipe, and I never do. Even when I use a recipe to get an idea for something, it never turns out the same. I always throw in a bunch of crap or mess with the texture or make a flavor more or less prominent. Usually I don't have 50% of what's on the list so I just use what I have, and probably 85% of the time I don't even look at recipes at all and just fiddle with stuff. It's what's the most fun about cooking for me for sure.

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Offline idolminds

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #52 on: Wednesday, April 24, 2013, 06:43:16 PM »
Usually I'll follow a recipe if its my first time making something, that way I sorta know what I'm aiming for and can then judge like, maybe I'd like it with less of this spice or more of whatever.

Though I do follow recipes for baked goods. There's some science going on in those things so you can and probably will totally ruin them.

Offline Quemaqua

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #53 on: Wednesday, April 24, 2013, 06:49:10 PM »
Haha, yeah, in agreement there. I'll maybe add some stuff but generally I don't know what I'm doing when it comes to baking, so I'll stick pretty close to a recipe for that since I don't want to screw it up.

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Offline Cools!

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #54 on: Wednesday, April 24, 2013, 07:22:37 PM »

Offline gpw11

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #55 on: Saturday, April 27, 2013, 08:27:19 PM »
Posted by a girl I used to date on Facebook.  She actually started going vegan as I was dating here and started out totally non-militant...this is something that (From what I can tell) has ramped up over the last six months or so.  She totally has a personality that gets caught up in stuff, but I really don't know what I was thinking.



« Last Edit: Saturday, April 27, 2013, 08:53:23 PM by gpw11 »

Offline gpw11

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #56 on: Saturday, April 27, 2013, 08:29:05 PM »
Oh, yeah.....that's what I was thinking.




Maybe vegan really is a lot better for you.
« Last Edit: Saturday, April 27, 2013, 08:54:22 PM by gpw11 »

Offline gpw11

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Re: Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #57 on: Monday, April 29, 2013, 11:59:40 PM »
Sorry, I totally didn't mean to hijack this, but thought it was kinda hilarious how (some) people start casually vegan and then start posting about how much more Awesone it is once they have super human bodies.  Carry on.

Offline Quemaqua

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #58 on: Tuesday, April 30, 2013, 05:30:20 AM »
No worries man. I think it's hard to remain sort of casual or unexcited about it once you do it. I've only been at it for like a couple weeks, and I'm losing weight without any more exercise than walking the dog, getting nearly all my nutritional needs met from food and drastically reducing the need for any vitamins or supplements of any kind, I have more energy and focus, and just all around feel a lot better than normal. Even emotionally I feel less prone to getting down about shit, and I've not been nearly as angry. Some of that I was expecting, or at least to a certain degree. Some of it I wasn't, or not to the degree I've experienced it thus far.

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Offline Xessive

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #59 on: Wednesday, May 15, 2013, 11:17:40 PM »
Ok, I did not know this was a thing but apparently one of my friends has revealed that she is a "raw vegan." Which means she's vegan and she will not eat anything that's cooked.. Raw plants. This could technically work with Arabic cuisine, as we do have a lot of raw vegetable and fruit options but I had never heard of anyone exclusively eating raw veg.

Offline Quemaqua

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #60 on: Thursday, May 16, 2013, 07:26:55 AM »
Raw is generally considered to be somewhat better for you since anything you cook has a tendency to lose a lot of vitamin and mineral content during the cooking process. But there are also some foods that are considered better cooked, and some that gain different properties when you cook them, so I think the jury is out on whether or not being exclusively raw is as beneficial as some think. I haven't done enough research on it to know. That said, you'd be amazed what some people can do with raw foods. There's a vegan place in Berkeley that's got one half of the menu that's cooked, one half that's raw. And the raw stuff I tried there was pretty tremendous. It sounds super limiting, but you can do more than you'd at first think. Must definitely take some creativity, though.

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Offline gpw11

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #61 on: Thursday, May 16, 2013, 07:31:23 PM »
I almost exclusively eat all my vegetables raw....which totally isn't the same thing, but whatever.

I had a friend growing up who was vegetarian (or fagetarian, as we used to like to say).  His sister was friends with mine and she only ate raw (not adhering to anything, just didn't eat anything cooked ever).  I remember her not being very healthy, but that's probably just because she was purely living off of vegetables and fruit.

Offline Quemaqua

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #62 on: Friday, May 17, 2013, 01:37:20 AM »
That's a good way to kill yourself. Any vegetarian diet needs a solid base of starches, grains, etc. You'll be completely calorie deficient without them even if you're good on your vitamins. Probably totally lacking in protein, too. It's actually really hard not to be sufficient in protein despite what most people think, but if you're entirely avoiding nuts and beans and stuff you're probably not hitting the mark.

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Offline Xessive

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #63 on: Friday, May 17, 2013, 05:34:41 AM »
It's funny, despite not eating too much meat my physician says my body is retaining too much uric acid, which would suggest I'm consuming too much protein. However, in my case it seems to be a genetic condition where my body just naturally hangs on to more uric acid per consumption and releasing less than the average person, which could potentially lead to gout if I'm not careful. Fortunately, I had already adopted a more veg-friendly diet anyway, but my doc says I should still avoid beans and nuts in general and focus more on grains, starches, and leafy greens. Fine by me, I love spinach and potatoes :D Oats are great too!

Offline Quemaqua

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #64 on: Friday, May 17, 2013, 10:31:48 AM »
Watch the dairy intake also, that can be a contributor.

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Offline Xessive

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #65 on: Friday, May 17, 2013, 03:30:05 PM »
Watch the dairy intake also, that can be a contributor.
Oh yeah, thanks! Either way I'm relatively lactose intolerant now, so I avoid it anyway. No need to be gassy :P

Offline Pugnate

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #66 on: Wednesday, May 22, 2013, 10:42:11 PM »
Vegan hippie kills a baby. Feeds it to a man eating plant:

http://www.thehealthyhomeeconomist.com/baby-breastfed-by-vegan-mother-dies/


Offline Quemaqua

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #67 on: Wednesday, May 22, 2013, 10:59:12 PM »
Uh... okay. I can't tell if you're trying to make a point or just screwing around. Comments denote the real issues only a few down. Where do people even think animals get most of these wonderful things from? Oh, right: the plants they eat.

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Offline Xessive

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #68 on: Thursday, May 23, 2013, 12:39:14 AM »
And bacteria! Plenty of bacteria! Mmm, mmm good!

Offline Cools!

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #69 on: Thursday, May 23, 2013, 03:30:03 PM »
Uh... okay. I can't tell if you're trying to make a point or just screwing around. Comments denote the real issues only a few down. Where do people even think animals get most of these wonderful things from? Oh, right: the plants they eat.

However that doesn't mean plants are the most efficient method of getting everything you need.

In the case of the baby: there are very few non-animal sources of B12 and while an adult has enough of it stored to last a long time in a low B12 diet a baby doesn't have the stores yet and has higher vitamin requirement so are more susceptible to problems. Parents didn't know what they were doing, didn't have enough B12 in their diet and as a result the kid died.

Offline Quemaqua

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #70 on: Thursday, May 23, 2013, 05:09:44 PM »
B12 generally comes as a soil nutrient, deficient today because we use so many pesticides and wash our food to such a ridiculous degree, depriving humans of normal soil nutrients that animals get more abundantly from eating plants. This is a modern problem with plant-based diets, not a natural one. My point being that stupid, uninformed people who eat shitloads of meat kill babies all the time from malnutrition and neglect, and most people who hurt their kids from a nutritional standpoint do it by shoving fast food down their throats 10 times a week, feeding them soda, overdosing them on sugar, etc. etc. etc. Just because one unfortunate person made a mistake that fucked their kid up (and as was discussed, the kid should have been on some solid food by that point anyway) doesn't mean the death has anything to do with veganism. Stupid is stupid. Neglect is neglect.

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Offline Xessive

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #71 on: Friday, May 24, 2013, 06:34:14 AM »
This thread always makes me think of this: :P


Offline gpw11

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #72 on: Friday, May 24, 2013, 01:15:00 PM »
Explain this one, baby-killer.

Totally joking, but in all seriousness it's amazing how people react to these kinds of things.  Or any story about veganism....or fast food. Honestly, once you hit the point where you're making a big deal about how someone else wants to eat you need to step back, take a time out, and check yourself...because you're an asshole of the most pathetic type.

Offline Xessive

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #73 on: Friday, May 24, 2013, 02:44:54 PM »
There's really only 3 scenarios that dietary intervention would ever be necessary: 1. health of your children's diet or if the food is contaminated 2. when massive consumption could lead to extinction of a species, and 3. cannibalism. Apparently it happens.

Hmm.. How do we feel about carnivorous plants? I'm going with Awesome! ;D

Offline Cools!

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #74 on: Tuesday, June 04, 2013, 10:40:26 AM »
Haha.

An acquaintance of mine just posted a tweet about how she hasn't had meat or fish in her diet in over 10 years. I'm very tempted to ask her how often she's been in the hospital during that time. She lands in the hospital at least once a year for something digestive and whenever I talk to her she's always feeling weak or sick. Yet she constantly preaches about how awesome being a vegan is and how everyone else is horrible and doesn't care about their diet.

My point? I get why people might pick one diet or another, but just because you do it doesn't mean everyone else doesn't know anything about the food they eat.

Just wanted to say that, again.

Offline Quemaqua

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #75 on: Tuesday, June 04, 2013, 11:22:11 AM »
... okay?

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #76 on: Tuesday, June 04, 2013, 08:30:47 PM »
Don't be one of those vegans Que. We like you too much.

Offline Quemaqua

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #77 on: Wednesday, June 05, 2013, 05:30:03 AM »
"One of those" in what fashion? When I get irritated that the only thing people use my thread for is "I'd just like to remind you that vegans can be just as stupid as everyone else"?

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Offline Xessive

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #78 on: Wednesday, June 05, 2013, 06:19:24 AM »
"One of those" in what fashion? When I get irritated that the only thing people use my thread for is "I'd just like to remind you that vegans can be just as stupid as everyone else"?
Oh come on, man. Don' take it so personally.. This is the first and only vegan thread we have :) All vegan-related material will naturally fall in here, good and bad :D

After a few vegan hot chicks, you're my favourite vegan, Que!

Also, vegan is not to be confused with "Vegan" the native and former inhabitants of Planet Vega in the classic anime series Grendizer. Just thought I'd put that out there. yeah. k.

Offline Quemaqua

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #79 on: Wednesday, June 05, 2013, 09:06:13 AM »
Post just seemed in poor taste to me. "Hi vegan thread, just wanted to say for no apparent reason that I know this vegan chick who's a bitch, thus subtly implying that you are probably also a judgmental asshole who is likely to wind up in the hospital because of your stupid life choice. See ya."

It's easy to write off vegans as touchy if they respond poorly to something, but you guys don't see the other end of it. Neither did I until I switched, despite having been vegetarian for several long periods prior. I've gotten a metric fuckton of jokes, insults, "advice", and judgments from people over having gone vegan in a very short period of time, and it's grown more than a little tiresome, especially considering that most of the people it comes from are in far less than ideal shape or overall health, and most of them don't know dick about food or agriculture, nor ever claimed to until in they came to feel the need to defend their choices. I've basically given up corresponding with my uncle for now because in literally every single email he's decided it's necessary to make a joke about how many animals he's eaten in the last few days, how they were killed, and boy how tasty they were. And this guy has been on death's door for years, in large part due to his horrendous diet, and we've never even had a discussion about veganism, nor have I made even the slightest comment on the way he eats. But as soon as he heard about it, this is what he now feels the need to do, even though he's gay and has always been a die-hard liberal. You'd think he of all people would understand and have compassion for a choice outside the mainstream, but apparently not. Heather's also had at least 5 people who never before commented on anything she posts to Facebook all of a sudden feel the need to start commenting on any health or diet post she makes telling us how deluded we are, then start preaching about mankind's God-given right to kill anything that moves (this is the prevailing opinion in the south), or how they know it's wrong but they don't care, or even about how they like hurting animals because animals are so evolutionarily primitive they deserve it. So yeah, I'm pretty fucking tired of it, especially given that I don't tell anybody a damn thing unless they talk to me about it, and then all I do is just tell them what I like about it, not judge them for whatever their choices are.

Vegans aren't any touchier than anyone else. We just get substantially more shit about something it doesn't make sense that we get shit for to begin with. It's amazing that as a group we aren't more insular, because this seems to basically be the story I get from anybody I ask. It's almost always the same, with some variation in whether family members or close friends are being supportive or not.

I've actually been very grateful to the guys during the meet. We took them to our favorite vegan restaurant right when they got here (which everyone seemed quite pleased with, thankfully), nobody's poked fun or given me any shit, and they've even talked to me about it and let me ramble a little. I just bring my own dinner when they make their meals, and everybody's happy. It's been really refreshing considering the reception I've gotten in some other circles.

天才的な閃きと平均以下のテクニックやな。 課長有野