Author Topic: Kentucky Clerk of Courts Kim Davis, gay marriage, and modern U.S. politics  (Read 3152 times)

Offline scottws

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Kentucky Clerk of Courts Kim Davis, gay marriage, and modern U.S. politics
« on: Friday, September 11, 2015, 02:04:55 PM »
I imagine many of you have heard the case of Kim Davis, elected Clerk of Courts in Rowan County, Kentucky refusing to issue marriage licenses to gay couples in spite of the U.S. Supreme Court's ruling on the matter (and other court rulings since then related to her specific case) and going to jail.  I think it's ridiculous that she's making the noise that she is and that at least a few semi-prominent political figures (Mike Huckabee in particular) are propping her up.

Firstly, the Bill of Rights and court decisions since its enactment both establish the free practice of religion but also separate the goverment's endoresment of a specific religion (or group of specific religions).  So her refusal to abide the confirmed law of the land for religious reasons is really anti-Constitution.  It's fine for her to have the beliefs she has, of course, but she should have excused herself from the position as she could not consciously fulfill the duties of her office.

Also, she's compared herself to Rosa Parks as someone that stood up to injustice, but I've heard her compared to George Wallace standing in the entryway of the University of Alabama after segregation was truck down and I'm inclined to agree with that assessment.

Lastly, I think it's terrifying that policos like Huckabee are stating behind Davis.  What does that say about our leaders, or at least the leaders on the right?  The right wing push in this country is crazy.  It's as if they want to push us back into the dark ages of thought with the line of short-sighted things they want to teach our kids (ignore and suppress science because it inconveniently conflicts with some of our religious beliefs or how we make a lot of money).  And that's just the social issues.  Other than those, they don't even pretend to represent the middle class anymore as seemingly every last thing thing they fight for or against is in the support of the extremely rich or very large corporations.  The Republican leadership is so right wing that a similar comparison on the left would be if Hillary Clinton, Bernie Sanders, and Joe Biden were all straight up, hardcore communists that wanted to abolish the concept of money in the economy in the hope of creating some sort of utopian society.  Of course, the reality of the left today is nothing even remotely close to that.  It's terrifying!

Offline PyroMenace

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Re: Kentucky Clerk of Courts Kim Davis, gay marriage, and modern U.S. politics
« Reply #1 on: Friday, September 11, 2015, 02:41:34 PM »
Yea I completely agree, it is crazy and terrifying. I've noticed George Takei has been all over it and he's pretty much hit the nail on the head.


Offline idolminds

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Re: Kentucky Clerk of Courts Kim Davis, gay marriage, and modern U.S. politics
« Reply #2 on: Friday, September 11, 2015, 02:57:25 PM »
The funny thing is she never had to serve jail time, she chose to. She could have simply allowed the other clerks to sign the licenses if it was that big a deal to her. But she refused to allow them to. So not only was she denying the marriage license to couple that should legally get them, she was also forcing her religious views on her underlings by making them follow her rules as well.

When she went to jail, all the other clerks agreed to issue licenses. Except one. Which is Davis' son. Shocker.

What a terrible human being.

Offline Quemaqua

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Re: Kentucky Clerk of Courts Kim Davis, gay marriage, and modern U.S. politics
« Reply #3 on: Friday, September 11, 2015, 05:50:25 PM »
Agreed entirely. I'm pretty left-leaning these days, but I'm exceedingly not fond of that side of the aisle either, to be clear, and am in a number of ways still fairly conservative. But making this person out to be a hero is an incredibly misguided action, and political leaders standing by her is even more difficult to believe. Except that it isn't. The Republican party has turned into a complete joke. Not so much because they're really THAT much worse than the Democrats in practical matters (a lot of Democrats vote for an awful lot of shit their constituents plead with them not to), but because they're just so open about how little they give a shit. The red has gone SO red in the last couple of election cycles, and the blue seems to have at least stayed roughly the same shade, whether it's your cup of tea or not. I think that says something. I wouldn't vote for Hillary Clinton if you put a gun to my head because I think she's a horrible person and the definition of a self-serving politician, but I couldn't in good conscience vote for a single one of the blowhards across the aisle. It's unimaginable how distasteful I find those people. There isn't a single one who doesn't enrage me, which is amazing given just how bloody many of them there are.

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Offline Cobra951

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Re: Kentucky Clerk of Courts Kim Davis, gay marriage, and modern U.S. politics
« Reply #4 on: Friday, September 11, 2015, 11:26:35 PM »
It seems to me this woman should simply be fired.  I don't understand how she ended up serving jail time.  That only makes her seem like a martyr to her cause.  I have no problem with people having religious or moral scruples about contentious subjects like abortion or even gay marriage.  But they have no place in a position of power with the state, where she is obligated to serve the law.  She needs to leave the employ of the state, and make her living otherwise.

Offline Xessive

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Re: Kentucky Clerk of Courts Kim Davis, gay marriage, and modern U.S. politics
« Reply #5 on: Saturday, September 12, 2015, 01:25:35 AM »
It seems to me this woman should simply be fired.  I don't understand how she ended up serving jail time.  That only makes her seem like a martyr to her cause.  I have no problem with people having religious or moral scruples about contentious subjects like abortion or even gay marriage.  But they have no place in a position of power with the state, where she is obligated to serve the law.  She needs to leave the employ of the state, and make her living otherwise.
Exactly. I don't agree with her necessarily but jail time seems excessive. You don't do your job you get reassigned or fired, not go to jail.

Offline idolminds

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Re: Kentucky Clerk of Courts Kim Davis, gay marriage, and modern U.S. politics
« Reply #6 on: Saturday, September 12, 2015, 04:21:39 PM »
They jailed her because it was about all they could do to punish her.

Quote
Getting rid of a county clerk isn't easy. Davis is an elected official, so she would have to be impeached by the state legislature. Not even the governor could fire Davis on his own.

"The future of the Rowan County Clerk is now in the hands of the courts. The legislature has placed the authority to issue marriage licenses squarely on county clerks by statute, and I have no legal authority to relieve her of her statutory duty by executive order or to remove her from office," Governor Steve Beshear explained. "The General Assembly will convene in four months and can make any statutory changes it deems necessary at that time. I see no need to spend hundreds of thousands of dollars of taxpayers’ money calling a special session of the General Assembly when 117 of 120 county clerks are doing their jobs."

Even if a special session were called, the assembly may not agree to impeach her.

Of course, Davis could just resign. But, according to her lawyer, she apparently isn't interested in doing that. "The tragedy is that there are simple ways to accommodate her convictions. Just remove her name from the marriage licenses. That’s all she has asked from the beginning," Davis's attorney said. She'd like to keep her job under a unique set of circumstances for issuing the licenses. She's seeking a religious exemption to create these circumstances. Thus far, the courts have denied her suggestion.

So they *might* impeach her in 4 months when the General Assembly reconvenes. That was too long a wait and something had to be done. They could have fined her but crowdsourcing is a thing and it wouldn't be too hard for a few churches to collect the money and pay her fine for her. Hell I could see a GOP candidate offer to pay her fine for publicity.

So jail it is. Or was. Whatever.

Offline Cobra951

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Re: Kentucky Clerk of Courts Kim Davis, gay marriage, and modern U.S. politics
« Reply #7 on: Saturday, September 12, 2015, 04:45:03 PM »
That did cross my mind (though I didn't know it for a fact).  Impeachment = firing, and clearly, they have cause.  I'm sure she can be suspended pending investigations, with next-in-line becoming acting-clerk-of . . . etc, etc--there's always a way when a public official goes seriously off the rails.