Author Topic: So I'm going vegan.  (Read 42763 times)

Offline Quemaqua

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So I'm going vegan.
« on: Tuesday, April 16, 2013, 06:18:53 PM »
Finally decided to bite the bullet and do it. Day 3 is today. Lunch is a pair of whole wheat pitas with non-dairy mayo in between, smoked tofurky slices, raw kale and spinach, and some Frank's Red Hot sauce. Oh, and a slice of vegan cheese. Good shit.

I've been an animal rights activist for a long time now, though I've also been convinced of the health benefits of vegetarianism and veganism for a long time, but I just never made the effort. I always looked at it as sort of a Shangri-La, an eventual end point, somewhere I'd get someday if I had the time and energy to spare. I was 99% vegetarian for 3 years or so, but never made it all the way and never completely made it vegan, despite keeping an almost-vegan kitchen at home.

It isn't one thing or the other that led me to it... I never considered it any kind of moral wrong to eat meat, just a moral wrong to treat livestock the way we do (and I've always been completely aware that I could never kill an animal just to eat it, if push came to shove), and I've always enjoyed meat and animal byproducts. I used to drink practically a gallon of milk a day, and I could kill a burger like nobody. Cheese was essential.

The other night I just got fed up. I'd been feeling progressively more sick whenever I'd eat meat, and I had some eggs my landlady was letting spoil basically, which didn't go down well at all after I cooked them... then I saw a picture of a dog being boiled alive in Korea for food purposes, which is done routinely there with dogs and cats. I've seen hundreds of pictures of animal atrocities over the years, including that, but that was the worst I'd ever seen and the last one I could take. It pushed me to just stop making excuses and be done with it.

So here I am on the other side and really enjoying it. Just figured I'd share for anyone that cares.

天才的な閃きと平均以下のテクニックやな。 課長有野

Offline idolminds

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #1 on: Tuesday, April 16, 2013, 06:43:31 PM »
Ive had some really good vegetarian foods. Went to a catered dinner recently where mom had the vegetarian lasagna and I had teriyaki beef. I was jealous, hers was way better.

But man, vegan in Texas? Thats hardcore.

Offline TheOtherBelmont

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #2 on: Tuesday, April 16, 2013, 08:01:35 PM »
But man, vegan in Texas? Thats hardcore.

It's actually not as bad as you may think.  A lot more vegan and vegetarian friendly options have popped in the last several years, especially where I am at.  If you are near a college of some sort or a place where a lot of younger people live you are bound to find vegan and vegetarian stuff in stores and restaurants fairly easily.  Hopefully it goes well for you, Que.

Offline Quemaqua

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #3 on: Tuesday, April 16, 2013, 08:43:55 PM »
Thanks mates. It isn't too bad here. You definitely have to do more work and there aren't a lot of restaurants that have much to choose from (or anything at all), but you don't have to be too fancy as far as getting stuff for the home kitchen. I'd kill to be near Austin, though, I'm sure there's all kinds of good stuff. We do have one good vegan place (http://www.spiraldiner.com, pretty awesome!), but that's about it. Back home there are like 4 vegan restaurants around where Mom lives.

天才的な閃きと平均以下のテクニックやな。 課長有野

Offline Cools!

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #4 on: Tuesday, April 16, 2013, 10:08:32 PM »
Good luck. Just don't turn into an asshole, 'cause pretty much every vegan I know is a total douche.

Offline Xessive

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Re: Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #5 on: Tuesday, April 16, 2013, 10:32:15 PM »
Awesome dude, we're with you! Going with what Cools said, just don't turn into a preachy, holier-than-thou prick. I'm not saying vegans are pricks but the majority of the ones I met certainly were.

I'm an animal rights activist but I despise Peta.

Offline Quemaqua

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #6 on: Tuesday, April 16, 2013, 10:50:51 PM »
I don't really know many vegans (and for the record, I hate most animal rights organizations because most of them cause as many problems as they try to solve). I've met a few vegan pricks over the years for sure, but those have usually been more lifestyle people rather than people with something behind them (lifestyle people are usually stupid no matter what arena you're talking about). I've known just as many chill folks, and I'm not preachy or judgmental. I don't expect anybody to come to a change in their life unless they find a real reason and conviction to do so. That comes at different times and in different forms for everybody. This just happened to be my time. I like to share things that I think matter, but I don't instantly judge every person on Earth who doesn't turn it around right off. I do hope they'll end up thinking about stuff like health, social responsibility, and the humane treatment of living things, but most modern societies set our lives up on different foundations. It takes time to get away from that even if you want to. Case in point, me. Logically, this is a choice I should have made a long time ago, I just made excuses not to because I didn't want to make the effort to learn a different way and to give up conveniences I'd come to rely on. In the end, though, it was a lose-lose proposition. I've been unhealthier than I should have been for years, wasted more money than I should have, and all for what? To eat something tasty but empty that forced me to spend money on supplements just to get proper nutrition? Usually it just made me feel sluggish and depressed anyway. My mood and energy and outlook all improve by leaps and bounds when I'm eating right, and it's not like you have to sacrifice delicious or substantial food. Vegan food is fucking awesome!

天才的な閃きと平均以下のテクニックやな。 課長有野

Offline idolminds

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #7 on: Tuesday, April 16, 2013, 11:01:57 PM »
Boba is vegan, right? THIS IS IMPORTANT!

Wait, fuck, milk tea. No its not. This is the worst news ever. We're going to have an intervention.

Offline TheOtherBelmont

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #8 on: Tuesday, April 16, 2013, 11:08:41 PM »
Boba is vegan, right? THIS IS IMPORTANT!

Wait, fuck, milk tea. No its not. This is the worst news ever. We're going to have an intervention.

They make ones with soy milk.

Offline gpw11

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Re: Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #9 on: Tuesday, April 16, 2013, 11:17:19 PM »
Respect. I'm not in tune with the concerns but it's something I could never do even if I was.

Offline gpw11

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Re: Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #10 on: Tuesday, April 16, 2013, 11:18:17 PM »
Note:  I'll still probably find ways to make fun of you from time to time.



Kinda unrelated:  still smoking?

Offline idolminds

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #11 on: Tuesday, April 16, 2013, 11:29:31 PM »
Quote
They make ones with soy milk.



Sorry, I was instantly reminded of this.

Offline Quemaqua

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #12 on: Wednesday, April 17, 2013, 12:18:29 AM »
Not smoking, no. Lungs have suffered enough, and I still suffer with them. Little bastards.

And man, I haven't seen Lewis Black in forever. Whatever happened to him? One of the best guys in stand-up during my lifetime, I'd say.

As for milk: God I loved milk. Between my Dad and I, when I was younger, we used to go through a gallon a day. But the stuff isn't really even naturally digestible. There was some research that even suggested folks thousands of years ago couldn't process it, and that the tolerance had to be developed. Even still most people can't process lactose, whether they tolerate it or not. Plus it's awful for you, basically just liquid fat and sugar, and there's evidence to suggest that it actually strips you of calcium despite what we all grew up believing thanks to ads (we've learned a lot about calcium in the last while). It's pretty horrendously cruel, too, on the scale in which we produce it, which I was totally ignorant of for years. Funny enough, I don't miss it at all even though I'm not too fond of most soy and rice milks. I've found certain brands of almond milk that are delicious and are a really great substitute. They taste creamy and rich despite being not even remotely as high in fat and calories as animal milk, and I've also had several kinds of oat milk that were delicious and probably even closer to the real thing (though for some reason I can never find places that stock it anymore... no clue why).

天才的な閃きと平均以下のテクニックやな。 課長有野

Offline Xessive

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #13 on: Wednesday, April 17, 2013, 02:05:54 AM »
 A few years ago I had to make a cake for a friend who is lactose intolerant; I made a chocolate cake that was "almost vegan" since it had no dairy products. I say "almost vegan" because I still had to use egg whites. But I bet we can find an alternative to make the recipe proper vegan.

What I learned was that apparently orange juice makes a great alternative to milk in cake batter! I didn't use butter anyway and pure cocoa powder is about as vegan-friendly as you can get ;D

It's tough being vegan but if there's a will there's a way. You can always find great alternatives. When I was vegetarian I was hooked on fungi-based alternatives, which I preferred vastly to soy-based stuff; that said, I do love edamame!

Offline Quemaqua

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #14 on: Wednesday, April 17, 2013, 05:28:23 AM »
I don't really find it all that difficult. If you're attempting to replicate every single non-vegan food you can, then yeah, it's a bit rough. If you were raised like me to just make good stuff with whatever it is that's in the kitchen, it's really just a matter of stocking your shelves with what you know is good. Cakes and baked goods are tricky until you learn how to do them, though vegan baked goods and desserts can actually be wonderful (and some not... you have to know your taste in sweets, and "just how vegan" you're going to be, like whether you abstain from using refined sugars because most of them are processed using animal bone char). I've had some vegan cheesecakes that were unbelievably good, and a lot of chocolates/mousses/shakes.

As for soy... yeah, I'm not super big on that. I'll eat it and enjoy it, but I don't believe it's terribly healthy in large doses, and I think like 90% of the world's soy supply is now genetically modified bullshit. The mycoprotein/fungi stuff can be pretty good, though I've found that a lot of it doesn't agree with my system in any large amount. I generally try to stay away from stuff in boxes too much and just eat whole foods straight up, make stuff from scratch.

Breakfast this morning is organic steel-cut oats, raw almond slices, maple syrup, raspberries, blackberries, strawberries, and blueberries, tossed with a handful of flax seeds and some almond milk. I've only been doing this strictly for 3 days (today will be the 4th), and I already feel like a weight has been lifted from my shoulders. My body is still adjusting since even though I didn't eat much meat prior to this I did get dairy protein and stuff, but I feel so much less toxic it isn't even funny. Which isn't new. I felt that way when I'd get back to 100% vegetarian, which I did for long stretches. Mostly got fucked up when I'd go home and such since I didn't want to complain when people would feed me something else, and sometimes that would lead back to bad habits it would take me a little while to get out of.

天才的な閃きと平均以下のテクニックやな。 課長有野

Offline Cobra951

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #15 on: Wednesday, April 17, 2013, 09:35:20 AM »
Protein is probably the greatest challenge for a strict vegetarian.  Make sure you get enough of that, and you should be OK.  Good luck with the big change, man.  You may not want to call it a "lifestyle" change, but it's a big one nevertheless.

Offline Quemaqua

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #16 on: Wednesday, April 17, 2013, 10:17:22 AM »
It is at that. And thanks!

I don't find the protein too difficult. You have to be conscious of it but it isn't really that hard to get complete protein if you're paying attention.

The best part for me right now is that basically giving up eating out has given me an operating budget for the kitchen that's just awesome. I can afford so much good stuff that in the past I had to do without or only get a little of. For lunch today I made an organic spinach, kale, and butter lettuce salad smothered in a blender-blended mix of habanero salsa, balsamic vinegar, agave nectar, and a fat-ass avacado. And it was cheap despite the quality of all the ingredients. Dinner likely to be black beans, garlic, onions, and rice, with hot sauce and soy chorizo. Per serving, that will cost practically nothing.

天才的な閃きと平均以下のテクニックやな。 課長有野

Offline Cobra951

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #17 on: Wednesday, April 17, 2013, 11:57:36 AM »
That's making me hungry.  Yummy stuff.   :)

Offline scottws

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #18 on: Wednesday, April 17, 2013, 01:16:55 PM »
As for milk: God I loved milk. Between my Dad and I, when I was younger, we used to go through a gallon a day. But the stuff isn't really even naturally digestible. There was some research that even suggested folks thousands of years ago couldn't process it, and that the tolerance had to be developed. Even still most people can't process lactose, whether they tolerate it or not. Plus it's awful for you, basically just liquid fat and sugar, and there's evidence to suggest that it actually strips you of calcium despite what we all grew up believing thanks to ads (we've learned a lot about calcium in the last while).
How is this true?  Pretty much all mammals rely on their mother's milk at some point while growing up.  Unless you are talking about processed milk that you find in the grocery store...

As far as going vegan, I could never do it.  I like the taste of animal muscle too much.  But I have been trying to eat leaner and healthier, and save my fattier and less healthy foods for irregular occasions.

Offline Quemaqua

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #19 on: Wednesday, April 17, 2013, 02:37:33 PM »
Humans are the only species to continue to drink milk into adulthood, obviously because milk's sole natural purpose is for the nursing of infants. If you don't continue to drink it with much regularity, your body stops producing the enzymes needed to digest it properly (one of the reasons for lactose intolerance) since there's no real nutritional reason for you to keep drinking it (some debate the merits of using it to rehydrate after a workout, and cite the long chains of amino acids as assisting in building muscle, but there's really nothing you get from milk that you can't get elsewhere, in certain cases in much more bio-available forms, i.e. more readily usable by the body). But milk is not a universal substance, and it differs compositionally between animals. Milk from a human female is actually higher in lactose than cow's milk, and higher in fat. Cow's milk has minerals human milk doesn't, and is higher in protein. Different breeds of cow also produce milk that differs from other breeds. And, of course, unless you're getting it from a consistent local source or are paying for better quality organic stuff (and even then you're really not guaranteed anything because many agricultural companies lie pretty much constantly about basically everything), it's going to have residual hormones and antibiotics in it. And no matter who you get it from, it's a biologically produced substance from mistreated animals forced to eat feed made from all kinds of bad shit, most especially renderings of other ground up cows (legislation hasn't stopped this practice entirely), euthanized shelter animals, roadkill, dead horses, pigs, chickens, and turkeys, fecal matter from chickens, and bovine blood and fecal matter. This all varies from place to place, but this is what rendering plants produce, and even if you're not drinking milk that comes from cows fed all that, they're usually still fed other bad stuff like cheap, shitty, genetically-modified soy, corn, and other stuff that isn't very good for them (especially given that both of these are the crops most overloaded with pesticides; along with cotton and wheat, they get about 80% of the pesticides used in the US). Hell, they can even get stuff like DDT remnants that are still in the ground after all these years. And as we all know from nursing mothers of our own species, milk is highly susceptible to contamination, which is why mothers are so careful about avoiding certain things that could cause harm to their babies.

天才的な閃きと平均以下のテクニックやな。 課長有野

Offline gpw11

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #20 on: Wednesday, April 17, 2013, 05:16:08 PM »
I thought you said you weren't going to be an asshole about this?


Offline gpw11

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #21 on: Wednesday, April 17, 2013, 05:16:36 PM »
JUST KIDDING BUDDY!



But fuck, milk is delicious.

Offline Quemaqua

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #22 on: Wednesday, April 17, 2013, 05:22:38 PM »
Hey, I'm not telling anybody to stop, or saying they're stupid for liking milk. I love the shit, and I readily admit that nothing is quite the same. I do, however, consider not ingesting shitloads of poison to be a worthwhile tradeoff, though.

天才的な閃きと平均以下のテクニックやな。 課長有野

Offline gpw11

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #23 on: Wednesday, April 17, 2013, 05:34:43 PM »
I know, I'm just giving you a hard time.  Obviously, I'm more than happy for you...and the reduced competition for the cheese of the world stemming from your exit from the market.

Offline Quemaqua

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #24 on: Wednesday, April 17, 2013, 05:39:45 PM »
I will definitely miss cheese too. Though I have to say, you'd be amazed at the "cheese" sauces vegan chefs can make using cashews. Fucking delicious.

天才的な閃きと平均以下のテクニックやな。 課長有野

Offline Xessive

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #25 on: Wednesday, April 17, 2013, 09:42:50 PM »
Humans do naturally become lactose intolerant over time as they age anyway. Ever get gassy after a glass of milk or some cheese? That's happening, deal wiv it! :P

I'm not against drinking but I do believe that at some point it becomes needless for us. More than anything else I think we drink it for taste. I've taken to occasionally drinking "lactose-free" milk or using it in recipes instead of regular milk.

Offline Pugnate

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #26 on: Wednesday, April 17, 2013, 10:04:22 PM »
My wife is vegetarian for spiritual reasons (bhuddism) and she is doing pretty OK in a culture where people love meat.

If you really want great veg. options try Thai cuisine. Also, this won't be easy. The first few months will be hard... but you will manage!

Offline Cools!

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #27 on: Friday, April 19, 2013, 10:22:39 AM »
Oh quiet Pug, we all know you have a perfect wife. :P

Offline Quemaqua

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #28 on: Friday, April 19, 2013, 11:26:05 AM »
It really isn't as hard as people think. And I've been strictly vegetarian at home for several years now, so it's only been when I went out or did stuff with friends that I had meat. My focus now is just on ditching animal byproducts in my home (not that difficult) and getting more strict about making my lunches and stuff for school days, learning what places sell at least a few food items that I can eat in case I get stuck, etc. It's really not too bad. After the first week, I've already dropped like 3 and a half pounds without exercise.

天才的な閃きと平均以下のテクニックやな。 課長有野

Offline Cools!

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #29 on: Friday, April 19, 2013, 11:29:09 AM »
Yeah, that's going to be tough. The hardest for me would be cheese.

Offline Quemaqua

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #30 on: Friday, April 19, 2013, 11:37:14 AM »
They make a lot of vegan alternative cheeses that are pretty excellent. They don't taste quite right on their own all the time, but are a quite reasonable substitute when you put them on things. That said, cheese is fucking terrible for you anyway. I find I don't miss it much even though I used to eat an awful lot of it. Which actually goes for most things. We think we can't give something up because we're too used to it or like it too much, but I haven't found a single food that was even 1/15 as difficult to give up as cigarettes. The taste of your food is over almost instantaneously with the end of each bite, but the lingering effects of what it does to your body last a good while over the course of the day. I'm not saying tasty food is irrelevant, only that I get enough of what tastes really good to me on a vegan diet that I'm not at all concerned about getting pleasure from my food.

Actually, it's been a bit strange. I've found myself taking joy in food and cooking in a way I haven't in years, and I've always loved cooking (including meat... grilling outdoors especially). Lately I'm getting a charge out of it just during prep. I'd say it's just the newness of it, but a lot of what I make now isn't really so different from what I used to make at home, since I got to the point where I just didn't prepare meat at home... not sure what the deal is. I feel a lot less pissed off in general lately too.

天才的な閃きと平均以下のテクニックやな。 課長有野

Offline Cools!

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #31 on: Friday, April 19, 2013, 11:50:00 AM »
I enjoy cooking as well. I'm not great at it, but I do want to get better at it.

We [my family] actually don't eat a lot of meat. My dad complains about it, but in general we only have a bit of it a couple of times a week. We aren't even that much into eggs or dairy products. I mean, I only drink milk as part of cereal and that's only because I'm too lazy to make something else in the morning. Even though I love cheese, I could probably go without it at some point as well since the stuff commonly sold here isn't anywhere close to what I used to have when we lived in Europe.

Offline ren

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #32 on: Friday, April 19, 2013, 02:45:38 PM »
I love vegans. The ones I know always bring the tastiest food to potlucks and are all great cooks.

Check out the Veganomicon if you haven't already. Most the vegans I know have a copy of this cookbook and every recipe I've had from it has been delicious. Shoutout to the Apple Chili in particular.

Also, if you're into Indian food, there's a huge amount of diversity in vegan selections. I eat everything but a good chunk of my meals end up being vegan for that reason.

Offline Quemaqua

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #33 on: Friday, April 19, 2013, 07:18:09 PM »
Yeah, I actually have been eying the Veganomicon for a while now, and Indian food is awesome. Curries are fantastic.

天才的な閃きと平均以下のテクニックやな。 課長有野

Offline Pugnate

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #34 on: Saturday, April 20, 2013, 11:17:30 AM »
I love vegans. The ones I know always bring the tastiest food to potlucks and are all great cooks.

Check out the Veganomicon if you haven't already. Most the vegans I know have a copy of this cookbook and every recipe I've had from it has been delicious. Shoutout to the Apple Chili in particular.

Also, if you're into Indian food, there's a huge amount of diversity in vegan selections. I eat everything but a good chunk of my meals end up being vegan for that reason.

Is Indian food vegan or vegetarian?

Offline ren

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #35 on: Saturday, April 20, 2013, 02:28:57 PM »
Depends how you make it. Most Indian food is vegetarian because they load everything up with butter. If you take that component out it's usually vegan unless the dish is based on a meat or dairy product.

Offline Pugnate

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #36 on: Saturday, April 20, 2013, 02:55:08 PM »
Yea I think it is more vegetarian than vegan. I think going Vegan is way harder, considering that you have to let go of dairy. Milk and eggs are a tough thing to lose.

Offline Quemaqua

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #37 on: Saturday, April 20, 2013, 04:34:21 PM »
Meh. I gave milk up for the most part long before going vegan. Butter is far harder, and even that really isn't that bad. Eggs are a bit harder, but there are a lot of workarounds, and you'd be surprised how many things that "require" them really don't. The thing that mostly sucks is just not being able to eat eggs outright, though I'm anxious to try this one thing I found. Vegan chef makes a fake hardboiled egg she swears to god tastes just like the real thing, and can do it a bit differently to make an egg salad sandwich with no eggs.

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Offline idolminds

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #38 on: Saturday, April 20, 2013, 04:45:04 PM »
I'll have to see what I can replace eggs with in my molasses cookies. Unless my eggs are ok, since our chickens are free range most days and the cage is quite spacious when they go in. So..I dunno, guess thats up to you to decide.

Offline Quemaqua

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Re: So I'm going vegan.
« Reply #39 on: Saturday, April 20, 2013, 09:12:25 PM »
Haha, we'll have to see how bad the temptation comes down on me come holiday time. If it was strictly about inhumanity then I'd just consider other sources for things that I really wanted, and some people do. It's not like there are any hard and fast rules about it. I think for me it just becomes easier when you draw a line and decide not to cross it.

天才的な閃きと平均以下のテクニックやな。 課長有野